{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/1061", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 1061, "subject": "Peace of Mind", "messages": 3, "voices": 3, "first": "1998-08-25T17:33:57+00:00", "last": "1998-08-26T09:33:18+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Alex David Groce", "address": "adgroce at eos.ncsu.edu" }, "date": "1998-08-25T17:33:57+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Peace of Mind", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "\tI still find the \"Purgatorio\" hypothesis to fit best with my\ninterpretation of \"Peace\". This IS Weer's life as it was lived (or, perhaps,\nas he tells it to himself, which may be subtly different than the real thing).\n The tacking of memos onto the board, the nailing down of the final memos, is\nWeer's exploration of his past.\n\tIn summary (roughly). The fall of Eleanor Bold's elm wakes Weer's\nrestless soul, and begins a process of telling its own story. The\nNecronomicon, \"the book that binds the dead,\" is appropriate, in that it is by\nbinding his life into a story that Weer comes to terms with his painful\n(although not, in my opinion, murderou, other than Bobby) and solitary life.\n He also binds himself to the others who helped to create this story, binding\nthe other dead to himself (we can assume that all are dead, given the time it\nwould take for the elm to grow and topple). In fact, the spin given to ghostly\nlife here reminds me of T. S. Eliot's \"Little Gidding\"--\"the end of all our\nexploration will be to arrive at the place that we started from, and to know it\nfor the very first time\". Only after death can Weer \"know\" his life.\n Ironically, the purpose of the binding is to set Weer free, to no longer\nhaunt his house or his skull, but to the an only hinted at something else\n(which I think is what the Chinese head-rest at the end indicates, a \"popping\"\nof a layer of reality, a joining of the other \"purged\" dead--his Aunt is\ncalling him, after all.)\n\tIt seems to me that the placing of the memos on the board (I don't have\nthe book with me at the moment to point out specifics) indicates that a certain\nmemory (the order being holographic, not chronological) has been dealt with.\n The story of the Sidhe suggests that this \"unnatural\" extension of Weer's self\nis about to be replaced by a true immortality (true/false immortalities are a\nfavorite theme of Wolfe's). He has outlived his time in his skull, on Earth,\nand now comes a baptism of Father, Son and Holy Ghost to give him Peace.\n\"'. . . The time of the sidhe is long past, and the time of geese is passing.\n And in time men, too, will pass, as every man who lives long learns in his own\nbody. But Jesus Christ saves all.'\"\n\tActually, this line has always given me the haunting image of that elm\nfalling over Weer's grave not just fifty years later, but perhaps even after\n(for whatever reason) men no longer live..." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "\"And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free.\" - John 8:32\n--\nAlex David Groce (adgroce at eos.ncsu.edu)\nSenior (Computer Science/Multidisciplinary Studies in Technology & Fiction)\n'98-99 NCSU AITP Student Chapter President\n608 Charleston Road, Apt. 1E (919)-233-7366\nhttp://www4.ncsu.edu/~adgroce" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "William H. Ansley", "address": "wansley at warwick.net" }, "date": "1998-08-25T23:33:31+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) Peace of Mind", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Alex David Groce (adgroce at eos.ncsu.edu) said:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "\"'. . . The time of the sidhe is long past, and the time of geese is passing.\nAnd in time men, too, will pass, as every man who lives long learns in\nhis own\nbody. But Jesus Christ saves all.'\"\nActually, this line has always given me the haunting image of that elm\nfalling over Weer's grave not just fifty years later, but perhaps even after\n(for whatever reason) men no longer live..." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I am rereading _Peace_ again and taking notes. (Man oh man, does that ever\nslow me down and make what is normally a pleasure into a chore. I don't\nknow how any of you scholarly types out there can do it day in and day out.)\n\nBut the up side is that I can say very quickly that if you turn to page 53,\nparagraphs 6 through 10, in the Orb edition of _Peace_, you will find\nOlivia Weer explaining to Professor Peacock why humanity will no longer\nexist in \"thousands and thousands of years\" (this is on the way to the\ncave). Admittedly, this is too long to be the life of an elm, but still it\nties in with what Alex David Groce says above.\n\nWilliam Ansley" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Michael Straight", "address": "straight at email.unc.edu" }, "date": "1998-08-26T09:33:18+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) Peace of Mind", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Tue, 25 Aug 1998, Alex David Groce wrote:\n\tI still find the \"Purgatorio\" hypothesis to fit best with my\ninterpretation of \"Peace\". This IS Weer's life as it was lived (or, perhaps,\nas he tells it to himself, which may be subtly different than the real thing)." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "[...]" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Necronomicon, \"the book that binds the dead,\" is appropriate, in that it is by\nbinding his life into a story that Weer comes to terms with his painful\n(although not, in my opinion, murderou, other than Bobby) and solitary life." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "[...]" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Only after death can Weer \"know\" his life.\n Ironically, the purpose of the binding is to set Weer free, to no longer\nhaunt his house or his skull, but to the an only hinted at something else\n(which I think is what the Chinese head-rest at the end indicates, a \"popping\"\nof a layer of reality, a joining of the other \"purged\" dead--his Aunt is\ncalling him, after all.)" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "[...]" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": " The story of the Sidhe suggests that this \"unnatural\" extension of Weer's self\nis about to be replaced by a true immortality (true/false immortalities are a\nfavorite theme of Wolfe's). He has outlived his time in his skull, on Earth,\nand now comes a baptism of Father, Son and Holy Ghost to give him Peace.\n\"'. . . The time of the sidhe is long past, and the time of geese is passing.\n And in time men, too, will pass, as every man who lives long learns in his own\nbody. But Jesus Christ saves all.'\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "While I must admit that I'm still enamored of my own \"it's a Chinese\npillow dream of a possible life\" theory, I have to admit that your\ninterpretation works pretty well, is satisfying, and strikes me as\npossibly closer to Wolfe's intent. It also has the virtue of not\nundermining the reality of all the other fascinating characters in Weer's\npast. \n\nOne thing about the dream idea, is that it bears some similarity to the\nidea we've been discussing in tBotNS of there being several Severians\nliving his life over and over until he gets it right (an idea much more\nEastern than Christian). Except I don't think Weer is going to literally\nrelive his life, it's more like Scrooge and the Ghost of Christmas Future. " }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "\tActually, this line has always given me the haunting image of that elm\nfalling over Weer's grave not just fifty years later, but perhaps even after\n(for whatever reason) men no longer live..." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Now you've haunted me too. \n\n-Rostrum" } ] } ] }