{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/1077", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 1077, "subject": "Hierodules", "messages": 3, "voices": 3, "first": "1998-09-02T08:28:18+00:00", "last": "1998-09-02T21:27:13+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "m.driussi", "address": "m.driussi at genie.com" }, "date": "1998-09-02T13:52:00+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Hierodules", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Mark Millman,\n\nGood summary of the possibilities.\n\nInteresting how native lifespan figures into time travellers: OB&F\n(dog lifespan); Inire (past his years); Father Thyme (physically ages\nas he travels); Master Ash (hint of Thyme as he walks to answer the\ndoor--Severian hears old footsteps growing young and virile).\n\nIn thinking about the odd trinity of OB&F, working off the idea of\nB&F being children and/or larvae, and assuming that once they are\ngrown up O will leave them as two, a couple--then I wonder about Adam\nand Eve, and the naked couple dropped of by Hierodules in the play as\nwell as (repeatedly?) in the reality. (Re-seeding the fairie, as it\nwere.)\n\nOr do they just grow up into those silent giant statues that roam the\ngardens of the House Absolute? They are certainly alike in terms of\nangelic beauty.\n\n=mantis=" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "John Gersten", "address": "jgersten at slip.net" }, "date": "1998-09-02T08:28:18+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) Hierodules", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Wed, 2 Sep 1998 m.driussi at genie.com wrote:\nInteresting how native lifespan figures into time travellers: OB&F\n(dog lifespan); Inire (past his years); Father Thyme (physically ages\nas he travels); Master Ash (hint of Thyme as he walks to answer the\ndoor--Severian hears old footsteps growing young and virile)." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "With regard to OB&F, I've often wondered about their experience of time\ngenerally. I had the impression that they actually lived time \"backwards\"\nwith reference to Severian's (and everyone else's) motion through time,\nand only \"switched around\" briefly (perhaps with Ossipago's help?) to\nmatch Severian's time-direction when they needed to interact with him.\n\nAre B&F born in the future? Do they then \"age\" as they pass backward in\ntime (from Sev's point of view)? This would seem to be the case. But\nthen how can they interact, even briefly, with people whose physiological\nand neurological processes are, time-wise, working backward from their\nown? Perhaps they use artificial means to briefly sort of \"snap\"\nthemselves around to Sev's time-arrow direction? Or am I just\novercomplicating things (in a Wolfe book?!? )?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Or do they just grow up into those silent giant statues that roam the\ngardens of the House Absolute? They are certainly alike in terms of\nangelic beauty." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Or are the statues perhaps proto-larval forms that miss getting animated\nwith a spark of individual soul? For whose benefit exactly are they\nprowling the environs of the HA?\n\nJohn" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "CRCulver", "address": "crculver at aol.com" }, "date": "1998-09-02T21:27:13+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) Hierodules", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Mantis said:\n\n\nI thought it was pretty well established that those are electronic\nsurveillance devices that Inire uses to monitor the grounds of the House\nAbsolute. I'm sure they are referred to as \"Father Inire's pets,\" or \"Father\nInire's eyes\" somewhere in the BotNS.\n\n\nAnd he pondered:\n< I wonder about Adam and Eve, and the naked couple dropped of by Hierodules\nin the play as well as (repeatedly?) in the reality. (Re-seeding the fairie,\nas it\nwere.)>\n\nI always used to assume that those people were Hierodules, but not necessarily\nFamulimus and Barbatus. I must comment here, however, that the point of\nreseeding Urth and giving it back sentient life is so that *humanity* will be\nable to create the Hierodules, since there was the chance it was the right\nSefiroth at the right time. So, the people dropped in the Garden of the HA are\nhuman.\nThe hypothesis lately has been raised that the Meschia and Meschiane of Ushas\nare actually sailors from the Ship Tzadkiel, but I'm not yet convinced.\n\nChristopher R. Culver \nhttp://members.aol.com/crculver/index.html" } ] } ] }