{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/1389", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 1389, "subject": "Kevin Malone", "messages": 6, "voices": 5, "first": "1999-02-25T10:18:48+00:00", "last": "1999-04-03T19:20:35+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Tony Ellis", "address": "tony.ellis at futurenet.co.uk" }, "date": "1999-02-25T10:18:48+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Re: Kevin Malone", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Roy wrote:\n I just finished re-re-reading \"Kevin Malone\", from _Endangered_Species_." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "A gem of a story, which I've often re-read purely for the pleasure of doing so.\nAnd I have no intention of spoiling it for you or for anyone else, but here are a\ncouple of hints:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "What I would like to know is: who did what to whom, and why? Is KM a ghost,\nor just what he purports to be?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "He's neither." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": " What relationship did the murder victim have to KM? Neither KM nor\nPriest actually refer to her as KM's mother. The incident is related in\nresponse to a query about KM going to an orphanage. And what are we to make\nof the narrator's parting hunch that both murderer and victim being named\nMalone may be coincidental? Answers anyone?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "There -is- no relationship between Kevin and Betty Malone. Once you understand\nthat it all falls into place: Kevin Malone -thinks- Betty Malone and the elder Mr\nMalone were married, -thinks- that he was their child in the lost Eden of the\nhouse in its heyday. But if the names are just coincidental, and there -was- no\nchild, that cuts his whole fantasy off at the root. In which case, where -do- his\nchildhood memories of the big house come from? And the longing to recreate that\nlost world which has driven his whole life?\n\nThink about that, and think about the narrator wondering in the very last line of\nthe story, if it might be possible \"for a man, even a very rich man, to be\nposessed and not to know it.\"" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "1999-02-26T02:01:59+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Re: Kevin Malone", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Tony Ellis wrote:\n\nThere -is- no relationship between Kevin and Betty Malone. Once you\nunderstand\nthat it all falls into place: Kevin Malone -thinks- Betty Malone and the\nelder Mr\nMalone were married, -thinks- that he was their child in the lost Eden of\nthe\nhouse in its heyday. But if the names are just coincidental, and\nthere -was- no\nchild, that cuts his whole fantasy off at the root. In which case,\nwhere -do- his\nchildhood memories of the big house come from? And the longing to recreate\nthat\nlost world which has driven his whole life?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " I hope these questions were not rhetorical. :-) If there was no child,\nthen who is Kevin Malone? Where did (does) the money come from to buy and\nmaintain the estate? If any of the testimony of the narrative is to be\ntrusted, then a maid named Betty Malone was murdered and someone, who may or\nmay not have been the murderer, committed suicide in consequence thereof.\nWhy was she murdered, and by whom? What bearing does that have on Kevin, or\nthe current \"young couple\"?\n In this story, again, there are two Wolfe characters - the narrator and\nKevin - who are misogynists.\n And what about the \"young couple\"? Why does Marcella remain?\n As far as \"spoilers\" go, in the archives I believe it is stated that all\nreaders of this list are presumed to be familiar with the corpus of Wolfe's\nwork. Is that not so?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Think about that, and think about the narrator wondering in the very last\nline of\nthe story, if it might be possible \"for a man, even a very rich man, to be\nposessed and not to know it.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " Possessed by whom or what? Spoil it for me, by private e-mail if you\nwish.\n\nRoy" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Peter Westlake", "address": "peter at harlequin.co.uk" }, "date": "1999-02-27T15:48:37+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) Re: Kevin Malone", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "At 10:18 1999-02-25 +0000, Tony wrote:\nRoy wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": " I just finished re-re-reading \"Kevin Malone\", from _Endangered_Species_." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "A gem of a story, which I've often re-read purely for the pleasure of doing so.\nAnd I have no intention of spoiling it for you or for anyone else, but here are a\ncouple of hints:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "What I would like to know is: who did what to whom, and why? Is KM a ghost,\nor just what he purports to be?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "He's neither." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": " What relationship did the murder victim have to KM? Neither KM nor\nPriest actually refer to her as KM's mother. The incident is related in\nresponse to a query about KM going to an orphanage. And what are we to make\nof the narrator's parting hunch that both murderer and victim being named\nMalone may be coincidental? Answers anyone?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "There -is- no relationship between Kevin and Betty Malone. Once you understand\nthat it all falls into place: Kevin Malone -thinks- Betty Malone and the elder Mr\nMalone were married, -thinks- that he was their child in the lost Eden of the\nhouse in its heyday. But if the names are just coincidental, and there -was- no\nchild, that cuts his whole fantasy off at the root. In which case, where -do- his\nchildhood memories of the big house come from? And the longing to recreate that\nlost world which has driven his whole life?\n\nThink about that, and think about the narrator wondering in the very last line of\nthe story, if it might be possible \"for a man, even a very rich man, to be\nposessed and not to know it.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I've read this story more than once, and had very little recollection of it.\nThis discussion prompted me to read it again, and it's as though I was reading\nit for the first time. Everything is suddenly crystal clear - though I shall\ncheck with Tony to see that I've got it right! If so, then I think it's quite\nclear-cut, too, not like some other stories we've talked about here ...\n\nRoy, Tony - thank you!\n\nPeter." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "William H. Ansley", "address": "wansley at warwick.net" }, "date": "1999-03-01T00:02:01+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) Re: Kevin Malone", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Tony Ellis said:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "There -is- no relationship between Kevin and Betty Malone. Once you understand\nthat it all falls into place: Kevin Malone -thinks- Betty Malone and the\nelder Mr\nMalone were married, -thinks- that he was their child in the lost Eden of the\nhouse in its heyday. But if the names are just coincidental, and there\n-was- no\nchild, that cuts his whole fantasy off at the root. In which case, where\n-do- his\nchildhood memories of the big house come from? And the longing to recreate\nthat\nlost world which has driven his whole life?\n\nThink about that, and think about the narrator wondering in the very last\nline of\nthe story, if it might be possible \"for a man, even a very rich man, to be\nposessed and not to know it.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "And in response Peter Westlake said:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I've read this story more than once, and had very little recollection of it.\nThis discussion prompted me to read it again, and it's as though I was reading\nit for the first time. Everything is suddenly crystal clear - though I shall\ncheck with Tony to see that I've got it right! If so, then I think it's quite\nclear-cut, too, not like some other stories we've talked about here ..." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Boy, oh boy, do I feel stupid!\n\nI have read \"Kevin Malone\" again, twice, with all these hints and I still\ndon't know who or what is possessing Kevin Malone.\n\nTony Ellis, please enlighten me, by private email, of course.\n\nWilliam Ansley" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Allan Lloyd", "address": "lloyd at sundial.kc3ltd.co.uk" }, "date": "1999-04-02T08:52:38+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Kevin Malone", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Hello, this is my first posting to the Urth list so be gentle with me. I\nwas tempted out of lurker status by the discussion of Kevin Malone. It\nwas entertaining to watch two\nopposing views of the story being debated, but I couldn’t help feeling\nthat both had been distracted by a typical Wolfeian red herring.\nThis story is to me one of Gene’s more obvious Christian parables. The\nclues in the text\nare almost too many to mention, the most blatant being the butler’s\nname, Priest. The\nhouse is compared to a Renaissance palace which should have a “red robed\ncardinal\ndescending the steps.”\nThe “beautiful” couple’s first meal is lamb in aspic, the breakfast is\neggs Benedict. The garden is full of roses, and the first time we see\nKevin Malone, he is weeding the garden (removing plants that fail the\ntest?).\nThe couple are being tested for their suitability to join the ranks of\nthe family (of God), hence all of the servants who have already\nundergone the test have the same name,\nMalone.\nAfter a summer of paradise, the strain in their relationship exposes\ntheir lack of love, and they react in different ways. The wife offers\nher body to the butler and is gently refused, but the narrator threatens\nPriest with being thrown into the fire, a particularly Biblical bit of\nviolence, and thus fails the test, leading to his expulsion from the\ngarden.\nWhen Kevin Malone appears he bursts through the window in a gust of\nwind, with a\nmention of spirits and ghosts. When telling his story he mentions being\nbrought up in a\nroom over a stable, and makes reference to “supper at a long table” not\nbeing for him.\nWhen he talks of the murder of Betty Malone he mentions bloody rags and\na hammer,\nwith all the links with the crucifixion, and although they don’t know\nwhere she is buried, she is with them in the garden (resurrection).\nI think that the talk who committed the murder is not relevant, there\nare few clues in the text as to how or why she died, but the important\nthing is that both she and her murderer have been forgiven(she for\nhaving been a \"tramp\").\nKevin Malone himself is portrayed as a character with faults, especially\nmisogyny, but he has given up his wealth to serve others, as have the\nother servants who have obviously been previously tested in the same way\nas the current couple. (There are 24 of them, perhaps two sets of twelve\ndisciples.)\nThe wife sits at the feet of Malone, and symbolically dies when she\npasses out at his feet. She is reborn with a hangover next day, and\njoins the family, while the husband leaves the house and is last seen\nsearching for meaning but failing to find enlightenment.\nThe final sentence, with its repetition of the phrase “rich man” refers\nto the parable \nconcerning camels and eyes of needles, and seems to be saying that a\nrich man can be\npossessed by the spirit of God and earn himself a place in the Kingdom\nof God by serving\nothers.\nThe final argument lies in the names. Malone is an old Irish name\nmeaning “follower of\nSaint John”, so all the servants have the same name. Marcella is the\nfemale form of Mark, another apostle, and Kevin means “beautiful one”.\nI hope this makes some kind of sense, and is worthy of inclusion here.\nCould I say that reading the archives has brought a wealth of new\nmeanings and appreciation for me to the works of Wolfe, and please keep\nup the good work,\n Allan Lloyd" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "1999-04-03T19:20:35+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Re: Kevin Malone", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Welcome, Allan Lloyd!\n\n As one of the \"two opposing views\" I feel obligated to respond, but I\nhardly know where to begin. Someone said _I_ had \"too many Malones\"! I\ndon't understand why you state that \"all the servants have the same name\".\nThe current servants certainly don't.\n You also seem to be mixing mythologies. On one hand you have Kevin in\nthe role of Yahweh in The Garden, then as a Christ-like figure. Not to\nmention Betty in the role of Jesus with the crucifixion/resurrection\nallusions.\n Nor do I see any evidence in the text to support the notion that\nMarcella has suddenly \"seen the light\", so to speak, and found God. If a\nhangover was the hallmark of salvation, then atheists the world over would\nstop drinking! \n Finally, the phrase \"rich man\" only occurs once in the last sentence, at\nleast in my edition.\n Don't be discouraged; only those who stick their necks out risk\ndecollation, and I was never even an apprentice in the Order of the Seekers\nfor Truth and Penitence.\n\n Say, you didn't happen to read the Gilligan's Island stuff in the\narchives, did you? \n\nRoy" } ] } ] }