{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/1905",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 1905,
    "subject": "TBoTNS as Science and fantasy",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "1999-11-02T19:42:27+00:00",
    "last": "1999-11-03T02:13:31+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0028-0352@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Jeremy Crampton",
        "address": "jcrampto at gmu.edu"
      },
      "date": "1999-11-02T19:42:27+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) TBoTNS as Science and fantasy",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "There's a section in the text which I think of in reference to the science\nvs. fantasy nature of TBoTNS:\n\nCitadel Chapter 17 \"Ragnorok The Final Winter\", Ash is speaking:\n\n\"The distinction you mention no longer holds. Religion and science have\nalways been matters of faith in something. It is the same something. You\nare yourself what you call a man of science, so I talk science to you. If\nMannea were here with her priestesses, I would talk differently\".\n\nAlthough I don't necessarily agree with all these comments it does have the\nuseful aspect that it involves the reader in the process, rather than just\nsaying something \"is\" or \"is not.\"\n\nMany years ago Tim Maroney brought all this up on sf-lovers, namely that\nTBoTNS was fantasy because \"if Severian put his arm into a rainbow and\npulled out a butterfly, no-one would be surprised.\"\n__\nJeremy W. Crampton\t\t         http://geog.gmu.edu    jcrampto at gmu.edu\nDept. of Geography & Earth Science\n[MS 1E2]\t\t\t\t’Tis true; there’s magic in the web of it.\nGeorge Mason University\t\t\t\t\t--Othello (III.iv.69)\nFairfax, Va 22030"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0028-0355@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Daniel Fusch",
        "address": "dfusch at hotmail.com"
      },
      "date": "1999-11-03T02:13:31+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) TBoTNS as Science and fantasy",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0028-0352@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Jeremy:\n\n(snip)\nMany years ago Tim Maroney brought all this up on sf-lovers, namely that \nTBoTNS was fantasy because \"if Severian put his arm into a rainbow and \npulled out a butterfly, no-one would be surprised.\"\n\nI don't agree with Maroney's comment on classification here, because you \ncould say the same of fable and myth, which are both distinct from fantasy, \nand both of which Wolfe makes use of.\n\nBut I did want to say that that's quite a witty quote! I hadn't thought of \nit that way, but come to think of it, if Wolfe had Severian reach into a \nrainbow and pull our a butterfly, I wouldn't be surprised.\n\nWith Wolfe at the helm, you have to expect the unexpected. Quite literally!\n\nAnyway, that quote brought a chuckle.\n\n-Daniel"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}