{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/1910",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 1910,
    "subject": "Magic, alchemy etc",
    "messages": 1,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "1999-11-03T05:53:32+00:00",
    "last": "1999-11-03T05:53:32+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0028-0359@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "David Duffy",
        "address": "davidd at qimr.edu.au"
      },
      "date": "1999-11-03T05:53:32+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Re: Magic, alchemy etc",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Briefly delurking, I couldn't help but bite at the mantic comments wrt\nalchemy.  A brief search gives several images that *might*\ninform UotNS (I don't have any primary references here but all this\nrings a bell).\n\n(from http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/3474/alchemy.html)\n\nthe process leading up to the alchemical marriage is blackening ->\nwhitening -> reddening (gold and purple).\n\nBlack\n\n  ...a\n  night journey below the sea in which the hero, often compared to\n  Jonah, is swallowed by a monster. But the belly of Leviathan\n  becomes a matrix: an egg forms around the imprisoned man; it is so\n  extremely hot there that the hero loses all his hair; ejected by\n  the monster he springs forth from the primordial sea, bald as a\n  newborn babe.\n \nWhite\n\n* In the vegetal symbolism frequently employed by alchemy, the work of\n  whitening corresponds to the bursting forth of spring: after black\n  winter, all the colors are manifested in a profusion of flowers, but\n  blend little by little into the white offering of a lily.\n\n* In animal symbolism, while the work of blackening corresponds to the \n  \"flight of the raven,\" the work of whitening begins with the unfolding of\n  the \"peacock's tail\" (pavonis) and is completed in the paradisal vision\n  of a white swan sailing on a silver sea.\n\n* In Gichtel's symbolic representation, the albedo seems to\n  correspond to the \"marriage of Mars and Venus,\" that is, to the\n  union of the masculine center...with the feminine center\n  Here Venus is the goddess of Divine Love, not of the erotic; she is the\n  \"heavenly Venus,\" lovingly receptive to the spiritual presence.\n  One begins to see the role which these concepts must have played\n  in the medieval worship of the Lady, especially if we remember\n  that alchemy often adopted the symbolism of the \"Quest\" which\n  always culminates in a \"feminine\" image of the Soul of the World:\n  the Golden Fleece or the Chalice of the Grail.\n\nRed\n\n* Then \"philosophical incest\" and the great hierogamy of the nuptiae\n  chymicae are celebrated: the Sun is united with the Moon, the\n  Sulphur \"fixes\"Mercury; in man, the Spirit restores life and makes\n  it fruitful.\n* This is the ceremonial meeting of the Red King and the White\n  Queen. The King is crowned in gold, clothed in purple; he holds a\n  red lily in his hand. The Queen is crowned in silver and holds a\n  white lily. \n\n From now on the silent presence of the alchemist is a benediction\n on all beings. He is the secret king, the conciously central being\n who relates heaven and earth and ensures the good order of things.\n                                                                  \n\nThat is the seeker after truth starts in the black, is bent, folded and\nmultilated several times, and ultimately comes to a sunny disposition\nafter coming to terms with his own feminine side, and then the feminine\nside of the universe.  (Some of this seems to come from Dante or is it\nvv).  There is supposed to be a marriage of some sort associated with\neach transformation (Juturna? Thecla Dorcas [Valeria] Burgundofara Apheta\nBurgundofara [Valeria] contra Dante).\n\nWrt good v evil science, I am reminded of Tolkein and others' dichotomy\nof subtle, ecologically sound elvish magic (\"not magic at all\") [botany] \nversus the technological magic of Sauron and co [head transplants ;)].\n\nI also had a po-mo v mo comment.  Which is it if you present multiple\ninternally consistent explanations for the same event?  I hasten to add\nthat many times, the materialistic explanation seems a bit feeble -- the\nperson involved explaining away what they don't want to believe (eg the\nphysician ?name and Latro).\n\nDavid Duffy.\n\n| David Duffy.                                                    ,-_|\\\n| email: davidD at qimr.edu.au  ph: INT+61+7+3362-0217 fax: -0101   /     *\n| Epidemiology Unit, The Queensland Institute of Medical Research_,-._/\n| 300 Herston Rd, Brisbane, Queensland 4029, Australia                v "
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}