{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2140", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 2140, "subject": "mantis reads STRANGE TRAVELERS", "messages": 3, "voices": 3, "first": "2000-03-07T15:11:22+00:00", "last": "2000-03-08T10:31:41+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi", "address": "mantis at sirius.com" }, "date": "2000-03-07T15:11:22+00:00", "subject": "(urth) mantis reads STRANGE TRAVELERS", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Right, well took me long enough to get a copy, didn't it? And then other\nthings got in the way.\n\nWell, what's the rush anyway? I had already read/collected all but six of\nthe stories, so I already knew three-fifths of the material.\n\nAh, but it is a strange thing which happens when they are set side-by-side.\n\nDr. Nick's theory about the central theme (all the wrong escapes) is a very\ngood one and not one I would argue against. But what tickles the edge of\nmy mind right now is the weird genre threads that link the stories.\n\nAgain, I read most of these stories before. \"Bluesberry Jam\" had struck me\nas a Delany story--say something like THE EINSTEIN INTERSECTION and \"Time\nConsidered as a Heliex of Semi-Precious Stones\" and maybe some DHALGREN.\nQuintessential Delany stuff. Like Lo Lobi of TEI, with his musical machete\nand his Orpheus quest.\n\n\"Counting Cats in Zanzibar\" struck me as being Asimov's robo-psychologist\nwhasshername as rewritten by a downbeat author like Ballard. Did I make\nthe Tiptree connection at that point, or later? Certainly by the time I'd\nread \"The Man in the Pepper Mill\" in magazine form. The protag is so cagey\nabout her name.\n\n\"The Death of Koshchei the Deathless\" is related to Lang's. (I had\nforgotten how funny it is, which is depressing because I had only picked it\nup at WFC in Monterey--not all that long ago.)\n\n\"Bed and Breakfast,\" one of the ones I hadn't seen before, reminds me of\nChesterton and/or C.S. Lewis.\n\n\"And When They Appear,\" another new-for-me story. Really a kick in the\ngut, but then again, it isn't too far removed from \"The War Under the\nTree.\" (Imagine letters to the Editor: \"Why does Gene Wolfe hate Jesus?!\")\nVery Ballardian (an unexpergated EMPIRE OF THE SUN, perhaps).\n\n\"The Haunted Boardinghouse.\" Well, this is related to John Crowley's\nLITTLE, BIG: if you didn't know that the house-with-no-back [eek! what are\nyou saying?!] is like the five-faced house in LB, then there is also\nCrowley's name as one of the 20th century literary giants given in the\ntext. This story ends exactly like a John Crowley story almost always\ndoes.\n\n\"Useful Phrases.\" An obvious Borges piece. But coming right after \"THB,\"\nthat gives it an additional spin. Close to BIBLIOMEN territory.\n\n\"The Man in the Pepper Mill\" has the obvious surface reference to Tiptree;\nTiptree seems to lurk in \"The Ziggurat,\" too--many people seemed to sense\nthat when it first came out, so that year I asked Gene Wolfe if \"The\nZiggurat\" was a response to \"The Women that Men Don't See\" and he wrote\nback something like \"Gee, I wish I'd thought of that!\"\n\n\"Ain't You 'Most Done?\" was new-for-me. Gaiman related. As a circular\nbookend, riverrunning back to the beginning, but then there are\ncross-currents as it changes the first story. (FWIW, I didn't feel this\nwas YADM story, like \"The Dead Man\" and \"The Other Dead Man.\" It seemed\nmore like the reality warping in THERE ARE DOORS and various short stories\nwhere book characters come to life. Reader mileage varies, clearly.)\n\nAnd that's what got me to thinking: about how many of the other stories are\nlinked in odd ways, perhaps forming similar bookend/bridges. Three Tiptree\nstories; two stories with plastic dinosaurs. Women and expensive cars?\nCouples, couples, couples: how many permutations? Borges, Crowley, Gaiman:\nauthors we know Wolfe enjoys reading. But Tiptree? Ballard? Delany?\n(Ballard's presence might be just an artefact of my own reading--then again\nI do recall some disagreement with Ballard's fiction in some Wolfe\ninterview; but I do have a sense of Wolfe saying some positive something\nabout Delany in some interview somewhere.)\n\nAnyway, just a few thoughts.\n\n=mantis=" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Jim Jordan", "address": "jbjordan at gnt.net" }, "date": "2000-03-07T17:37:26+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) mantis reads STRANGE TRAVELERS", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "At 03:11 PM 3/7/00 -0800, you wrote:\n\n\"The Haunted Boardinghouse.\" Well, this is related to John Crowley's\nLITTLE, BIG: if you didn't know that the house-with-no-back [eek! what are\nyou saying?!] is like the five-faced house in LB, then there is also\nCrowley's name as one of the 20th century literary giants given in the\ntext. This story ends exactly like a John Crowley story almost always\ndoes." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Great link, but don't forget *The Name of the Rose* as a major player here.\n(labyrinth, library, latin).\n\nPatera Nutria" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Matthew Malthouse", "address": "matthew.malthouse at guardian.co.uk" }, "date": "2000-03-08T10:31:41+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) mantis reads STRANGE TRAVELERS", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Michael Andre-Driussi wrote:\nAnd that's what got me to thinking: about how many of the other stories are\nlinked in odd ways, perhaps forming similar bookend/bridges. ....Delany?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Of the suggestiong made the only one that I'm immediately familliar\nwith is Delany's \"Neveryon\" storied both begining and ending with\n(iirc) \"The Tale of Gorgik\".\n\nReading ST I had the thought that the construction _should_ indicate\na circular intent - but then was at a complete loss to see any\ncircularity in the series of stories which left me rather frustrated\nand disapointed.\n\nMatthew" } ] } ] }