{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2234",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 2234,
    "subject": "The Parliament of the Birds",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "2000-05-04T12:45:32+00:00",
    "last": "2000-05-05T07:46:58+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0028-0973@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Urash, Tom",
        "address": "turash at firstam.com"
      },
      "date": "2000-05-04T12:45:32+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) The Parliament of the Birds",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "The Parliament of the Birds is purportedly of Sufi origin (Persia being for\nmany centuries the most Sufic of all the Islamic world), and the influence\nof the Sufis, operating under the veil of Islam, was quite profound in\nEurope despite its rather esoteric workings. Sufism came naturally into\nSpain with the occupation by and trade with the North African Arabs and\nagain during the Crusades. \n\nIdres Shah's \"The Sufis\" is a remarkable book and goes into quite a bit of\ndetail concerning Sufi influences on quite a number of Europeans of\nhistorical times, several of whom may surprise you. Many of the so called\n\"teaching stories\" used by the Sufi masters have found their way into our\nculture though not always readily recognizable and almost never credited.\n\nI suspect Gene Wolfe, though certainly not to the degree of Doris Lessing,\nhas been influenced by the Sufis and the multi-leveled \"meanings\" so\nprevalent in their teaching stories... tom"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "-----Original Message-----\nFrom:\tAlice Turner [SMTP:akt at attglobal.net]\nSent:\tWednesday, May 03, 2000 10:08 PM\nTo:\turth at lists.best.com\nSubject:\t(urth) Re: Digest urth.v028.n198\n\nFrom the Kind and Helpful Ratso (what a paradox!)!"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 2,
          "text": "\"I came upon a Persian parable called _The Parliament of the Birds_,\nwhich\nsupplied me with a plot remarkably -- uncannily -- suited to what I\nhad\naltready thought up."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "For heavens's sake! Chaucer wrote \"The Parliament of Foules\" (Fowls)\nwhich I read in somewhat cribbed Middle English back when I was an\nEnglish major in college, but I don't remember (a) it (though if I had\nthe energy I could leap from my seat and consult my old textbook); or\n(b) that there was a Persian original. Where would Chaucer have got it\nfrom? But I'm sure he did. Crowley is quite scrupulous with period\ndetails in -The Deep- (as I prove in my esssay on the same that so few\nof you [humiliatingly for me] wish to read)."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0028-0976@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Urash, Tom",
        "address": "turash at firstam.com"
      },
      "date": "2000-05-05T07:46:58+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) FW: The Parliament of the Birds",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0028-0973@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Pardon me if you've received this already..."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "The Parliament of the Birds is purportedly of Sufi origin (Persia being\nfor many centuries the most Sufic of all the Islamic world), and the\ninfluence of the Sufis, operating under the veil of Islam, was quite\nprofound in Europe despite its rather esoteric workings. Sufism came\nnaturally into Spain with the occupation by and trade with the North\nAfrican Arabs and again during the Crusades. \n\nIdres Shah's \"The Sufis\" is a remarkable book and goes into quite a bit of\ndetail concerning Sufi influences on quite a number of Europeans of\nhistorical times, several of whom may surprise you. Many of the so called\n\"teaching stories\" used by the Sufi masters have found their way into our\nculture though not always readily recognizable and almost never credited.\n\nI suspect Gene Wolfe, though certainly not to the degree of Doris Lessing,\nhas been influenced by the Sufis and the multi-leveled \"meanings\" so\nprevalent in their teaching stories... tom\n\n\n-----Original Message-----\nFrom:\tAlice Turner [SMTP:akt at attglobal.net]\nSent:\tWednesday, May 03, 2000 10:08 PM\nTo:\turth at lists.best.com\nSubject:\t(urth) Re: Digest urth.v028.n198\n\nFrom the Kind and Helpful Ratso (what a paradox!)!"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 2,
          "text": "\"I came upon a Persian parable called _The Parliament of the Birds_,\nwhich\nsupplied me with a plot remarkably -- uncannily -- suited to what I\nhad\naltready thought up."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "For heavens's sake! Chaucer wrote \"The Parliament of Foules\" (Fowls)\nwhich I read in somewhat cribbed Middle English back when I was an\nEnglish major in college, but I don't remember (a) it (though if I had\nthe energy I could leap from my seat and consult my old textbook); or\n(b) that there was a Persian original. Where would Chaucer have got it\nfrom? But I'm sure he did. Crowley is quite scrupulous with period\ndetails in -The Deep- (as I prove in my esssay on the same that so few\nof you [humiliatingly for me] wish to read)."
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}