{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2246", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 2246, "subject": "LB, fairyphone, fairy history", "messages": 2, "voices": 2, "first": "2000-05-08T16:39:30+00:00", "last": "2000-05-08T21:29:13+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi", "address": "mantis at sirius.com" }, "date": "2000-05-08T16:39:30+00:00", "subject": "(urth) LB, fairyphone, fairy history", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Adam," }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "You wrote:\n Nor would I call the Drinkwater-occupied outermost fairy world a\n\"colony\" of the fairies; at any rate, the fairies will have no contact\nwith it once they themselves go further \"in.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I don't think this is the first time you've asserted this, but now I have\nto ask: From where arises your certainty that the old fairies (now\npresumably on the third level) will not have any contact in the future with\nAlice & Co. (now on the second level)? (Not that the fairy communication\nwith the first level Drinkwaters was all that crystal clear, of course.)\n\nThis seems to suggest that you think they (fairies) were in contact with\nthe Drinkwaters from the moment of their (the fairies) genesis in fairyland\n(and you do seem to think the fairies to be autochthonous to the next\nworld, iirc). If this is truly your opinion, then please share what must\nbe a fascinating timeline!\n\nAlso, as to the \"why\" of the fairy migration: one or some around here have\nmentioned that the fairies \"want to get away from the humans\" as the reason\nfor their migration to level three. Do you subscribe to this notion?\nBecause it seems to me that if the levels are as hermetically (heh) sealed\nas they seem to be, then human egress to level two is virtually impossible\n(no dangers of a human freeway to fairy, whereas fairies visit level one at\nwill); and since the fairies already have all of level two to themselves,\nthey are already \"away\" from humans.\n\nDid the fairies somehow discover an empty new world at level three (somehow\nbreaking through the barriers on their own because they are more advanced\nin the technology) and decide to migrate there, for whatever unfathomable\nreasons, is that your sense of it?\n\n=mantis=" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Adam Stephanides", "address": "adamsteph at earthlink.net" }, "date": "2000-05-08T21:29:13+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) LB, fairyphone, fairy history", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "mantis wrote:\n\nAdam,\n\nYou wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": " Nor would I call the Drinkwater-occupied outermost fairy world a\n\"colony\" of the fairies; at any rate, the fairies will have no contact\nwith it once they themselves go further \"in.\"" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I don't think this is the first time you've asserted this, but now I have\nto ask: From where arises your certainty that the old fairies (now\npresumably on the third level) will not have any contact in the future with\nAlice & Co. (now on the second level)?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I'm not certain at all, although I may sometimes have lapsed into\nexpressing my views without qualifiers. My belief--or, to be even more\nprecise, my impression--is based upon two things:\n\n1) Mrs. Underhill's thoughts, especially in the first paragraph of \"Give\nWay, Give Way\" (VI, 5), where \"she almost wished she could be\" at the\nwedding party, but can't because \"there was nothing more for her to\ndo.\" Why would she not appear at the wedding party if she were going to\nstay in contact with the Drinkwaters? Also, the final glimpse of her\nthoughts at the end of \"Come or Stay\" (VI, 5) show no trace of an\nintention to revisit the Drinkwaters.\n\n2) My sense of the fairies (and I don't have any citations for this) is\nthat their interaction with the Drinkwaters has been solely motivated by\nthe Tale. Now the Tale is over, so no further contact is necessary." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "This seems to suggest that you think they (fairies) were in contact with\nthe Drinkwaters from the moment of their (the fairies) genesis in fairyland" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I don't think this (see above), nor do I see how it follows from what I\ndo think." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "(and you do seem to think the fairies to be autochthonous to the next\nworld, iirc)." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I've never said so, iirc, and I never really thought about it. All I\nknow about the fairies' genesis that they are \"children of [Kronos's]\nchildren [i. e. the gods], related by marriage.\" (\"Daughter of Time,\"\nIV, 3) This would suggest that the fairies' genesis is Olympus rather\nthan fairyland, but you can probably make more out of that datum than I\ncan." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "If this is truly your opinion, then please share what must\nbe a fascinating timeline!" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Do I sense a wee hint of sarcasm here? I never claimed to be an expert\non LB, and I never gave it the concentrated study that you have. I'm\njust trying my best to puzzle out the book's riddles, like everybody\nelse. And for the record, I don't have a timeline for LB, and I don't\nknow how I'd begin to construct one." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Also, as to the \"why\" of the fairy migration: one or some around here have\nmentioned that the fairies \"want to get away from the humans\" as the reason\nfor their migration to level three. Do you subscribe to this notion?\nBecause it seems to me that if the levels are as hermetically (heh) sealed\nas they seem to be, then human egress to level two is virtually impossible\n(no dangers of a human freeway to fairy, whereas fairies visit level one at\nwill); and since the fairies already have all of level two to themselves,\nthey are already \"away\" from humans." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I may have put forward the escape-from-humans theory myself at one\npoint, but it is a puzzle. Since the humans can't get to level two, the\nfairies should already be safe there, but they're not. Contrariwise, if\nthe various levels are all the same world, just looked at differently\n(as is suggested at one point iirc, and as the wedding party's setting\nat Edgewood also seems to suggest) then they should be just as exposed\non level three as they are on level two. " }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Did the fairies somehow discover an empty new world at level three (somehow\nbreaking through the barriers on their own because they are more advanced\nin the technology) and decide to migrate there, for whatever unfathomable\nreasons, is that your sense of it?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I don't really have a \"sense of it.\" I'd have to reread the whole book\nto get a real sense of what the fairies are or what their motives are,\nand even then I probably would still be in the dark. Just flipping\nthrough now looking for citations, I've discovered stuff that forces me\nto alter my preconceptions.\n\n--Adam" } ] } ] }