{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2361",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 2361,
    "subject": "Lives and Times of the Master Tortuers III",
    "messages": 1,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "2000-08-19T13:43:45+00:00",
    "last": "2000-08-19T13:43:45+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0029-0176@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Talarican",
        "address": "exultnttalarican at mindspring.com"
      },
      "date": "2000-08-19T13:43:45+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Lives and Times of the Master Tortuers III",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "The second \"Master Palaemon exiled incognito older Gurloes\" scenario,\nsupposes that Palaemon had already been a master prior to his disgrace and\nexile. During his exile he named himself a journeyman as an incognito. (a\ncounterpart to Severian's ill-fated imposture of a master in the village of\nMurene by Lake Diuturna!) Or, he could have been stripped of his mastership\nif such a thing is possible.\n\nThus, Gurloes' age would correspond to that which LU conjectures, and \"forty\nyears ago\" refers to the time Gurloes himself was Sev 's age, that is, about\nnineteen and about a year away from masking. Master Palaemon, not yet\nexiled, is his teacher and mentor.\n\nThe only real difference in this scenario is that it makes Gurloes sixtyish\nrather than fortysomethingish at the time Sev is masked, and Gurloes still\ngets elevated to master at a rather tender age, if he is to already be a\nmaster at the time Severian is born.\n\n***\n\nChronology of the 3 guild masters\n\n\nc. 90? p.s. birth of Palaemon ( & Malrubius?)\n\nc. 70? p.s. Palaemon (and Malrubius?) masked.\n\nc. 70? p.s. Autarch Maruthas closes the roads \"that was when  I [Palaemon]\nwas your [Severian's, in 1 p.s.] age\"\n\nc. 60 p.s. earliest probable date of Gurloes' birth\n\nc.40? p.s.  Scholarly Palaemon is elevated to master,\n\nc. 42 p.s. as Gurloes remembers, \"things were harder, much harder, forty\nyears ago\"; he is a senior apprentice at this time ( as Severian is at the\ntime Gurloes says this to him, about 1 p.s.)\n\nc. 42 p.s. Master Palaemon teaches senior apprentice Gurloes. They have\nGurloes cranking the generator.\n\nc.40 p.s.  Gurloes rises to journeyman, having been Palaemon's star pupil\n\nc.35? p.s.  Malrubius elevated to master\n\nc. 32? p.s. Palaemon exiled for unspecified offences against the guild. He\neither was demoted or, as an incognito and/or out of a sense of remorse,\nchose voluntarily not to proclaim himself as more than a journeyman.\n\nc. 30 p.s. \"Journeyman\" Palaemon flogs Winnoc, tells him he is exiled from\nthe guild for an unspecified offense.\n\nc. 28? p.s. All masters except Malrubius are dying. They decide to risk\ndesperate unorthodox promotions to mastership to save the guild from\nextinction.\n\nc. 27? p.s. Palaemon reinstated in Matachin Tower, elevated to master,\nassumes responsibility to teach older apprentices, and does research.\n\nc. 25? p.s. Gurloes elevated to mastership in his mid to late thirties,\nolder than in the other scenario, but still possibly the youngest master\ntorturer in the guild's history.  This may have been brought to pass by the\ndeaths of  all masters other than the parolee Palaemon and the ill\nMalrubius.\n\nc. 20 p.s. Severian born.\n\nc. 11 p.s. Malrubius dies, after being bedridden with a long illness.\nPalaemon becomes master of apprentices.\n\n2 p.s., summer and fall  Severian nearly drowns, saves Vodalus in the\nnecropolis, encounters Triskele, Valeria, Thecla, Rundesind, Ultan, etc\n\n2 p.s. spring  Drotte and Roche masked. Severian becomes captain of\napprentices.\n\n1 p.s.   Severian masked, proceeds to screw up royally"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}