{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2537", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 2537, "subject": "Spanish Castle Magic", "messages": 1, "voices": 1, "first": "2001-01-10T10:06:07+00:00", "last": "2001-01-10T10:06:07+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "ddanehy at siebel.com" }, "date": "2001-01-10T10:06:07+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Spanish Castle Magic", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "\"The Laughing Skull\" wrote:\n1) Severian's 3 legged dog is named Triskle. The spanish word for\nsad is 'Triste', very close. If that dog's story isn't sad, I\ndon't know what is" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Actually, \"triskele\" is a standard (if uncommon) English word, which\nWebster defines as \"a figure composed of three usually curved or bent \nbranches radiating from a center.\" Possibly \"triste\" (French also)\nmakes a good resonance, though; Wolfe is very resonant..." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "2) Probably the most recognized is the term Calde, coming from\nAlcalde, meaning mayor" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I'm surprised you didn't also mention \"calde,\" \"hot.\" Certainly\nthe Calde's throne is a hot seat... Another resonance." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "3) The word 'Ayuntamiento' in Spanish means \"copulation.\" Seeing\nas how the cause lots of problems for Silk, could this mean that\nthey're \"The Fuckers?\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Interesting. It doubtelss comes from the same root as the term\nI'd thought of -- \"junta,\" which comes from Lat. \"jungere,\" to \njoin, and is cognate with Eng. \"yoke\" and so ultimately Sans.\n\"yuga,\" hence \"yoga.\" \n\nBut in fact \"ayuntamiento\" is simply the Spanish word for a city \ngovernment; see, for example, the official website for el \nAyuntamiento de Madrid, http://www.munimadrid.es/, or el \nAyuntamiento de la Villa de Breña Alta, Tenerife, \nhttp://www.balta.com/ -- there are many more; do a search for\nAyuntamiento on Yahoo! or some other search engine." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I'm sure there are loads more that I've missed, but I'd just like\nto see what the rest of you thought" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "It's worth noting that juzgado is also Sp. for \"court[house],\"\nbut also a panel of judges, and so is the root of the Eng. \nslang (Amer. western) word \"hoosegow.\"\n\n*****" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "And Tony Ellis wrote:\nDan'l Danehy-Oakes made some interesting suggestions, " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Thank you!" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Three key points first:\n\n1. I would like to resurrect Nutria's argument that Casteview\nis \"about perception\". " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "That's a very good point, and one I touched on with my comments\nabout glamours but quite missed as a major theme. Me 'at's off \nter th'rat." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "2. Tom Stoppard once described \"Rosencrantz and Guildenstern\nAre Dead\" as the dramatic equivalent of driving past Elsinore\ncastle. [...] you would have no idea from these snapshots what\nthe \"real story\" was all about. I find that a useful way of\nthinking about Castleview." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Yes, I agree -- we do not really know, and I believe we cannot \nknow, what the faery war is actually about. It's part of something\nbigger and possibly permanent; we see it only as it impinges on \nthe lives of some human and demi-human characters." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "3. We see the supernatural characters, which Dan'l Danehy-Oakes\nusefully identifies as \"fey\", primarily in terms of late western\nEuropean mythology, and particularly Arthurian mythology. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "And bad science fiction, and monster movies, and Westerns, and (as\nyou point out) urban legend -- at least." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "In the fine Wolfe short story \"A Cabin On the Coast\" a pipe-smoking\nleprechaun tells the protagonist \"Would ye like to see me as a tiny\ngreen man wi' horns like a snail's? I can do that too.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Good connect. That story does a lot to clarify how Faerie appear\nin things Wolfish." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Who is Lucie?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "A tenant of Meadow Grass who has been turned into a vampire." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I'm not sure that's all that clear -- I had the impression there\nwas something more/less about her from the beginning. But then...\nthis _works_." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "What's all the business with the organ playing in the museum?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I can't improve on Dan'l's \"cool effects?\" With its insanely,\nludicrously frenetic pace, and magically-transformed cats, I don't\nthink this is a book we are supposed to take -too- seriously." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Thank you. I think Wolfe was trying to write a _fun_ book, and \nlargely succeeded. It has several characteristics kind of uncharacteristic\nof Wolfe -- notably, the very short timeframe in which the action takes \nplace, and the frenetic, non-stop action. Things happen as fast here as\nthey do in TERMINATOR 2, and (as in T2) I think part of the intention is\nto keep things moving so fast that the audience doesn't have time to do\nmuch thinking until the whole thing's over (though, this being GW, I \ndoubt that this is done for purpose of keeping us from noticing massive \nplot holes)." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Viviane Morgan appears to be Vivian *and* Morgan le Fay. How does \nshe manage to be both?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Because these are just our personifications of the same supernatural\nbeing." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "... whatever \"the same\" means in this context. Again, I suggest\nthat identity is a little wonky on the other side of the meadow.\n\n\n--Dan'l" } ] } ] }