{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2634",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 2634,
    "subject": "Copperhead: The Fall",
    "messages": 1,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "2001-05-10T09:11:22+00:00",
    "last": "2001-05-10T09:11:22+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0030-0399@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Straight",
        "address": "straight at email.unc.edu"
      },
      "date": "2001-05-10T09:11:22+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Copperhead: The Fall",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "On Thu, 10 May 2001, Michael Straight wrote:\nStill, that's a big problem - Cain and Abel, and murder particularly, are\ndefinitely post-Fall, so it's hard to see how Adam (and Eden) could still\nbe glorified and unfallen if Cain has already killed Abel."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "The explanation came to me right after I hit send.\n\nLilith and Adam and Eden are post fall, as shown by Cain having already\nkilled Abel.  It's just that, even after the Fall, it took a while for\nhumans to lose their grandeur -- Adam lived for 930 years, and his\nchildren had long lifespans for generations (up until the Flood, leading\nsome Creation Scientists to theorize that the Flood came from a\n\"firmament\" of water that had surrounded the Earth, shielding people from\nUV and other harmful radiation, explaining the longer lifetimes).  And\nEden after the Fall remains a glorious place that must be guarded by an\nangel with a flaming sword.  \n\nSo the Fall has occured, but Adam is still more glorious than those of us\nwho have never talked with God face-to-face in the cool of the morning,\nand Eden is still the home of barking trees and sounding rams horns.\n\n-Rostrum"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}