{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2778",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 2778,
    "subject": "tangent: resources tied up by Final Solution",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "2001-08-11T17:44:45+00:00",
    "last": "2001-08-15T09:38:35+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0030-0628@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi",
        "address": "mantis at siriusfiction.com"
      },
      "date": "2001-08-11T17:44:45+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) tangent: resources tied up by Final Solution",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Hey gang,\n\nRecently the discussion of alternate history touched on Hitler, and the\nquestion of \"what if a less irrational/idealistic/insane leader had led\nGermany into WWII and beyond?\"\n\nWhich is something I myself had been mulling over, off and on, over the years.\n\nWhat if the leader had the sense to stop while he was ahead, rather than\ngoing for total victory?  (Well, that's a dicey one, really -- the\n\"rubicon\" I tend to think of is the invasion of France, but there are all\nsorts of complications.  Obviously, if the leader thought that the western\ndemocracies were decadent and weak, and the early victories seemed to\nsupport that, and sudden victories are needed, well--blitzkrieg would seem\nlike the only way to do it.  Give them enough time and the democracies will\nshift production, etc.  Nevermind the stupidity of invading Russia.)  What\nif the anti-Semitism wasn't so pronounced (even shifted into the \"Give the\nJews Madagascar\" scenario, picked up by Janet Berliner a few years back),\ncould that have helped the Nazis develop the atom bomb (Einstein pressed\ninto service: the bomb for Zion/Madagascar)?\n\nBut here's the one I really puzzle over, and I'm sure it has been addressed\nsomewhere in Holocaust literature a few times at least: IF the leader had\nnot used the resources (rail, police, army, etc.) on the Final Solution,\nand if these resources were then applied to military use, how would that\ntranslate?  There must be ballpark figures out there somewhere, like it\nwould've been worth this many more panzers or stukas or cold cash or\nwhat-have-you, and if anyone reading this right now knows such a figure or\nanswer to the question, please send me email.\n\nThat is: the Holocaust was a military drain, and I'm curious as to the net\nmilitary effect if Germany had not been engaged in such infamous \"monument\"\nbuilding.\n\nI'm actually not a fan of alternate history works, but certain thoughts\noccur to me from time to time.\n\n=mantis=\n\n\nSirius Fiction\nHas Moved To\nhttp://www.siriusfiction.com/"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0030-0630@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi",
        "address": "mantis at siriusfiction.com"
      },
      "date": "2001-08-15T09:38:35+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Re:tangent: resources tied up by Final Solution",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0030-0628@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "John Bishop wrote, beginning:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "I've seen some figures for \"war materiel\" produced\nper year by the major actors in World War II."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "And included a table.\n\nThanks for answering my question.  Very sobering stuff.\n\n=mantis=\n\n\nSirius Fiction\nHas Moved To\nhttp://www.siriusfiction.com/"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}