{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2888",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 2888,
    "subject": "The Ring & The Claw",
    "messages": 3,
    "voices": 3,
    "first": "2002-01-07T19:59:07+00:00",
    "last": "2002-01-08T15:30:49+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0031-urth.v031.n028.1@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes",
        "address": "ddanehy at siebel.com"
      },
      "date": "2002-01-07T19:59:07+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: The Ring & The Claw",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Dan Rabin wrote:\nWith respect to the recent discussion on Tolkien's influence on \nWolfe, I'd like to propose that the Claw of the Conciliator is, in \nsome respects, a Wolfean reversal of the One Ring:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Well, while I don't think I would go so far as this (in the sense of\nWolfe deliberately doing so), I think you make (the beginnings of) an\ninteresting case for a comparative discussion of the books, especially\nwrt a structuralist/poststructuralist discussion of the similar & \ndifferent ways the two objects fill the paradigm of \"ancient, \npowerful talisman.\"\n\nLet's add to your list of similarities:\nBoth objects come into the protagonist's hands by seeming chance.\nBoth objects give the possessor power \"according to his stature.\"\nBoth objects are ultimately destroyed during a battle with an enemy \n    who seeks to take it from the protagonist. \nNeither object looks extraordinary to a casual viewer.\n\nAnd to the reversal list: \nThe Ring is destroyed by seeming chance; the Claw is destroyed by \n    petty malice.\nFrodo finds himself unable to give up the Ring; Severian finds\n    that the \"owners\" will not accept (the remains of) the Claw."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0031-urth.v031.n028.3@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "matthew.malthouse",
        "address": "matthew.malthouse at guardian.co.uk"
      },
      "date": "2002-01-08T12:11:16+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) Re: The Ring & The Claw",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0031-urth.v031.n028.1@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "On 07/01/2002 19:59:07 Dan'l Danehy-Oakes wrote:\nAnd to the reversal list:\nThe Ring is destroyed by seeming chance; the Claw is destroyed by\n   petty malice."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "You might say that the ring is destroyed by the malice as well as the greed of\nGollum.\n\nBaldanders is greedy for many things (technology, sensation, etc) but actually\ndisdains the claw, another reversal.\n\n\nMatthew"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0031-urth.v031.n028.4@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Straight",
        "address": "straight at email.unc.edu"
      },
      "date": "2002-01-08T15:30:49+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) Re: The Ring & The Claw",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0031-urth.v031.n028.3@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "On Mon, 7 Jan 2002, Dan'l Danehy-Oakes wrote:\nLet's add to your list of similarities:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Both objects give the possessor power \"according to his stature.\""
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Does the claw give power to anyone but Severian?\n\n(I guess you can still make the comparison if you say only Severian has\nthe stature to use the claw's power, but it doesn't fit quite as well.)\n\n-Rostrum"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}