{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/2935",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 2935,
    "subject": "love & the inhumi",
    "messages": 3,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "2002-02-07T11:40:15+00:00",
    "last": "2002-02-12T20:31:34+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0202-103@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Andy Robertson",
        "address": "andywrobertson at clara.co.uk"
      },
      "date": "2002-02-07T11:40:15+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) love & the inhumi",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "----- Original Message -----"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 2,
          "text": "From: \"Alice K. Turner\" <aturner3 at nyc.rr.com>\nand Hyacinth's ghost in the ruined palace:  part mocking, part loving.\nWhat happened to them?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Nice post, hartshorn. Which is to say that I too have thought about these\nthings. How in the world could two so fundamentally different characters\nhave found a way to get along? With Silk it would be the healing power of\nsex,"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "or love . . .\n\nnow, come to think of it the whole business of the inhumi is about \"the\nhealing power of love\", isn' it?\n\nIf people stop hating the inhumi, who get their souls from people, will stop\nbeing god's scourge.\n\nUnfortunately Wolfe is not offering any facile answer here.   The healing\npower of sexual love does not work particularly well where the inhumi are\nconcerned:  Jahlee's \"humanisation\" and interior sexualisation and love for\nHorn/Silk only leads her to try to kill Nettle.\n\nIf anything the message of the books seems to be that you *can't* love the\nalien, or that it is a task that requires a god's patience.\n\n\n    hartshorn"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0202-149@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "James Jordan",
        "address": "jbjordan4 at home.com"
      },
      "date": "2002-02-12T17:33:03+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) love & the inhumi",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0202-103@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "At 05:40 AM 2/7/2002, you wrote:\nIf people stop hating the inhumi, who get their souls from people, will stop\nbeing god's scourge.\n\nUnfortunately Wolfe is not offering any facile answer here.   The healing\npower of sexual love does not work particularly well where the inhumi are\nconcerned:  Jahlee's \"humanisation\" and interior sexualisation and love for\nHorn/Silk only leads her to try to kill Nettle.\n\nIf anything the message of the books seems to be that you *can't* love the\nalien, or that it is a task that requires a god's patience.\n\n\n    hartshorn"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "         In another post I mentioned that Wolfe sees sanctification as a \nvery long and difficult process. His comment to me years ago about Severian \nwas that Severian has come from a horrible background, and is gradually and \ntraumatically trying to become a better person. I think we need to bear \nthis theme in mind in the Short Sun presentation of human/inhumi \nrelationships. Wolfe does, IMO, present what needs to happen: people to \nlove inhumi as they love themselves (love your Neighbor as you love \nyourself, and inhumi are part of Neighborness). But there are going to be \nloads of setbacks along the way. These failures ought not to be taken as \nindications that the programme is wrong.\n         When Jahlee dies in Nettle's arms, that is one of the most moving \nscenes I've ever read. It gives me chills just to remember it. It is a \nwonderful image of hope in spite of failure.\n\nNutria"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0202-152@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Andy Robertson",
        "address": "andywrobertson at clara.co.uk"
      },
      "date": "2002-02-12T20:31:34+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) love & the inhumi",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0202-149@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "----- Original Message -----\nFrom: James Jordan"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "       When Jahlee dies in Nettle's arms, that is one of the most moving\nscenes\nI've ever read. It gives me chills just to remember it. It is a wonderful\nimage\nof hope in spite of failure."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Actually, it seems to me a powerful image of failure in spite of hope :-(\n\n    hartshorn"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}