{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/3053",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 3053,
    "subject": "memory of Seawrack",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "2002-03-19T17:30:23+00:00",
    "last": "2002-03-20T11:45:15+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0203-383@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "maa32",
        "address": "maa32 at dana.ucc.nau.edu"
      },
      "date": "2002-03-19T17:30:23+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) memory of Seawrack",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Roy gave this passage:\n\n\"Every time I remembered something that happened there, I would\nthink of something that's happened since I've been with you, some little\nthing or something you said, and put it there instead.\"\n\nThis is the passage I was referring to: she is able to place memories in other \nplaces and times.  What is the \"there\"?  It is the past, underwater life she \nlived ... she is saying she can place events that happen with Horn in her \npast, and he can do it,too.  In any case, that is an ambiguous there that \nseems to mean a time as well as a place (and I don't think it refers only to \nher memory.)\n\nWilliam Ansley said something about that being a scrubbing brush?! Why would \nit climb up a tree?  If it's a soft brown underbrush,it will be right next to \na tree right?  Why would a hair brush run up a tree? How is there no basis for \nfurther discussion?  I don't understand what you are saying.  Besides, the \nleaf sprouting stuff is a foreshadowing of the vile intelligence of the avern, \nobviously a sentient plant that knows Severian is there and wants to kill him.\n I don't think my recollection was that faulty ... are you saying that it was \na hairbrush?!\n\nMarc"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0203-387@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "matthew.malthouse",
        "address": "matthew.malthouse at guardian.co.uk"
      },
      "date": "2002-03-20T11:45:15+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) memory of Seawrack",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0203-383@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "On 19/03/2002 17:30:23 maa32 wrote:\nRoy gave this passage:\n\n\"Every time I remembered something that happened there, I would\nthink of something that's happened since I've been with you, some little\nthing or something you said, and put it there instead.\"\n\nThis is the passage I was referring to: she is able to place memories in\nother\nplaces and times.  What is the \"there\"?  It is the past, underwater life\nshe\nlived ... she is saying she can place events that happen with Horn in her\npast, and he can do it,too.  In any case, that is an ambiguous there that\nseems to mean a time as well as a place (and I don't think it refers only\nto\nher memory.)"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Too much.  She's altering *her* memory.\n\nThe experiences she treasures replacing the past that distresses her.\n\nThe use of language reall isn't that ambiguous: there is only one possible\nrefferand for the last \"there\", the place in her mind where an older\nmemory existed."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "William Ansley said something about that being a scrubbing brush?! Why\nwould\nit climb up a tree?  If it's a soft brown underbrush,it will be right\nnext to\na tree right?  Why would a hair brush run up a tree? How is there no\nbasis for"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Because the point of the passage is the flambeaux giving life to that\nwhich is dead.\n\nTo \"give life\" to something already living would negate the wonder of the\nthought, it'd be superfluous and make the passage pointless."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "further discussion?  I don't understand what you are saying.  Besides,\nthe\nleaf sprouting stuff is a foreshadowing of the vile intelligence of the\navern,\nobviously a sentient plant that knows Severian is there and wants to kill\nhim."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "I recall - and memory is faulty - the mechanism of the avern being\nexplained.  Is there something that would substantiate acording it\ninteligence?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "I don't think my recollection was that faulty ... are you saying that it\nwas\na hairbrush?!"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "\"...rough brown brush...\"\n\nThink an old fashioned scrubbing brush, wooden back darkened by repeated\nimmersions, bristles simmilarly aged - I have one on my kitchen window\nsill if you'd like a picture.\n\nOne point though is that both the objects are given life when dead; but\nboth *were once living*.\n\nIf you wnat forshadowing think Claw and resurection.\n\n\nMatthew"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}