{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/3591", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 3591, "subject": "whorl in orbit", "messages": 3, "voices": 3, "first": "2002-11-19T07:24:01+00:00", "last": "2002-11-19T17:22:59+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Don Doggett", "address": "harlekin at earthlink.net" }, "date": "2002-11-19T07:24:01+00:00", "subject": "(urth) whorl in orbit", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Against the \"Whorl has been in orbit for thirty years\" possibly in the text\nand possibly said by Wolfe in an interview I lay down my \"longfather,\nculture hero of Ushas who left for the stars\" entry in Lexicon Urthus\np.184 - 185. And I would argue most vehemently that nothing is\nstraightforward enough in these texts to draw any definitive conclusions.\nHeck, for all I know, this is some elaborate joke by Wolfe, and the real\nnarrator of the whole 12 book series is L. Ron Hubbard.\n\nDon" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Charles Reed", "address": "cmreed at link.com" }, "date": "2002-11-19T15:37:40+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) whorl in orbit", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Don Doggett wrote:\nAgainst the \"Whorl has been in orbit for thirty years\" possibly in the text\nand possibly said by Wolfe in an interview I lay down my \"longfather,\nculture hero of Ushas who left for the stars\" entry in Lexicon Urthus\np.184 - 185. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "In order for the inhumi to have come aboard before the Silk is \nenlightened -- and I don't think you can question that Quetzal was on \nboard before Silk was enlightened -- then the Whorl has to have been in \norbit around the Short Sun at necessarily sub-light speeds. I simply \ndon't think there's any way around that conclusion." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "And I would argue most vehemently that nothing is\nstraightforward enough in these texts to draw any definitive conclusions.\nHeck, for all I know, this is some elaborate joke by Wolfe, and the real\nnarrator of the whole 12 book series is L. Ron Hubbard." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Don, if this is true, then what's the point? If you can dismiss any \npiece of evidence that doesn't fit in with your theory by just saying, \n\"Well, obviously the narrator is wrong.\" then you can twist the \nnarrative into any shape you like. I don't see the joy in that, because \nthen you're not working at interpreting the text, you're simply imposing \nyour will on it. I certainly don't believe that the narrator is \ninfallible, but I do believe that you have to take what he says at face \nvalue until something forces you to do otherwise. But that's just me.\n\nCharles" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "ddanehy at siebel.com" }, "date": "2002-11-19T17:22:59+00:00", "subject": "RE: (urth) whorl in orbit", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Against the \"Whorl has been in orbit for thirty years\" \npossibly in the text and possibly said by Wolfe in an \ninterview I lay down my \"longfather, culture hero of Ushas \nwho left for the stars\" entry in Lexicon Urthus p.184 - 185. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Okay, I don't have a copy of the Lex, so I don't know what it\nsays there ... but ... \"longfather\" is simply an antique word\nfor a male ancestor distant enough that you can't (or don't \nwant to bother) counting out the \"greats\" -- typically one who\nplays a patronymic or patriarchal role in the family history;\nAbraham would be \"longfather\" to the Jews. (Note that this does\nnot exclude the concept of \"culture hero,\" but does not\nrequire it.) The only modern use of the word I know outside of\nWolfe is -- who's surprised? -- Tolkien, who refers somewhere\nto the \"longfathers of the Dwarves.\"" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Heck, for all I know, this is some elaborate \njoke by Wolfe, and the real narrator of the whole 12 book \nseries is L. Ron Hubbard." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Oh, great, now you've gone and spoilt it all ... trying to \nlay engrams on us, eh?\n\n--Dan'l" } ] } ] }