{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/3789",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 3789,
    "subject": "DOORS: Green's intelligence",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "2003-01-21T17:18:21+00:00",
    "last": "2003-01-26T15:11:56+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0301-2754@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi",
        "address": "mantis at siriusfiction.com"
      },
      "date": "2003-01-21T17:18:21+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) DOORS: Green's intelligence",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Adam Stephanides wrote:\nI have to admit, when I last read TAD (several years ago, at least) it never\nstruck me that Green was lacking in intelligence (or courage, or\nenterprise).  And rereading the confrontation scene with Lara (chap. 31),\nGreen seems no less intelligent than Wolfe's other protagonists.\n\nActually, now that I think about it, Wolfe's main male characters in his\nnovels written after TBOTNS all seem to me to be more or less the same\nperson, except for Horn in OBW (and possibly Latro in the Soldier books, my\nmemory of which is sketchy)."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Respectfully I disagree.  The intriguing \"Viridian\" passage at the\nbeginning of the book might at first seem like a Wolfean lexical exercise\n-- \"Typical,\" one might say.  Erudite.  But I find it very interesting that\nGreen has this color vocabulary because of the appliances and computers\nthat he sells: these are words used by the manufacturers and has picked\nthem up.\n\nThis fact, that he is a computer/gizmo salesman, feeds well into my growing\nsense of Lara the techno-goddess.\n\nNotice what happens when Green has been forcefully rehabilitated: he is put\ninto Furnishings, a retro-world, a non-electronic world.  He starts selling\na lot, and reading up: he learns a new lexicon, this time related to\nfurniture.  You know what happens next: Love crashes through his new world\nin the form of a seaman's desk!\n\nNo matter where he is, White Goddess Love is going to ferret him out.\n\n=mantis="
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0301-2822@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Adam Stephanides",
        "address": "adamsteph at earthlink.net"
      },
      "date": "2003-01-26T15:11:56+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) DOORS: Green's intelligence",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0301-2754@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "on 1/21/03 11:18 AM, Michael Andre-Driussi at mantis at siriusfiction.com\nwrote:\nAdam Stephanides wrote:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 2,
          "text": "I have to admit, when I last read TAD (several years ago, at least) it never\nstruck me that Green was lacking in intelligence (or courage, or\nenterprise).  And rereading the confrontation scene with Lara (chap. 31),\nGreen seems no less intelligent than Wolfe's other protagonists.\n\nActually, now that I think about it, Wolfe's main male characters in his\nnovels written after TBOTNS all seem to me to be more or less the same\nperson, except for Horn in OBW (and possibly Latro in the Soldier books, my\nmemory of which is sketchy)."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Respectfully I disagree."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "[snip]\n\nI'm not quite sure what you're disagreeing with.  But if it was the\nassertion in my final paragraph, I probably expressed myself more strongly\nthan I'd meant to.  I didn't intend to say that the protagonists were\nidentical in all, or even most, respects.  What I meant was that they all\nseem to me to be the same basic personality type: what I think of as\n\"idealized middle American male\" (even when they're not American).  They're\nnot intellectuals, but they know how things work, and how to do things,\nwithout boasting about it.  They have a tendency to despondency, but are\notherwise psychologically \"normal\" (unlike, say, the various protagonists of\n5HC).  And they're fundamentally decent, without being priggish.\n\n--Adam"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}