{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4151",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 4151,
    "subject": "Thecla's fourth book",
    "messages": 3,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "2003-08-07T23:21:21+00:00",
    "last": "2003-08-08T17:00:56+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0308-3867@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi",
        "address": "mantis at siriusfiction.com"
      },
      "date": "2003-08-07T23:21:21+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Thecla's fourth book",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Andrew Bollen wrote:\n   I know there was some discussion of this, sometime,  but I can't find\nit on a quick search. Sev fetches four books for Thecla -  Wonders, a book\nof devotions, something to do with heraldry, and another one.  Hope I've\ngot that right - anyway, I recall that three of the books were  described\nin at least some detail, but one wasn't, which in Wolfe world usually\nmeans we're supposed to ask questions about it.  Thoughts?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "The hidden book is (Canog's) THE BOOK OF THE NEW SUN. (See Wolfe's essay in\nPLAN[E]T ENGINEERING for more details.)\n\n=mantis="
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0308-3872@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Don Palumbo",
        "address": "enpalumb at earthlink.net"
      },
      "date": "2003-08-08T17:00:56+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) Thecla's fourth book",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0308-3867@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Andrew,\n\nThat's really interesting, especially as the content of THE BOOK OF THE NEW \nSUN is already inside The Book of the New Sun in that we get the text of \nDr. Talos' play, which is explicitly based on it, for about twenty pages at \nthe end of CLAW, so it would be especially neat if this book itself was \nalso inside the book.  The dozens of other tales within tales in BNS are \nthe best examples of numerous other instances of the nod to fractal \nstructure that Wolfe is giving, here, in basing BNS on Campbell's monomyth \n(that Severian's companion through most of CLAW--which is the \"Belly of the \nWhale\" episode in the monomyth--is named Jonas is another \nbig-but-not-so-subtle nod), which also has a remarkably thorough fractal \nstructure (but not a whole lot of people know it).\n\nSo, is there any evidence in the text of the tetralogy itself that this 4th \nbook in THE BOOK OF THE NEW SUN?\n\nAnd where exactly can I find this essay in PLAN[E]T ENGINEERING?\n\n--Don Palumbo"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "At 04:21 PM 8/7/03 -0700, you wrote:\nAndrew Bollen wrote:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 2,
          "text": "   I know there was some discussion of this, sometime,  but I can't find\nit on a quick search. Sev fetches four books for Thecla -  Wonders, a book\nof devotions, something to do with heraldry, and another one.  Hope I've\ngot that right - anyway, I recall that three of the books were  described\nin at least some detail, but one wasn't, which in Wolfe world usually\nmeans we're supposed to ask questions about it.  Thoughts?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "The hidden book is (Canog's) THE BOOK OF THE NEW SUN. (See Wolfe's essay in\nPLAN[E]T ENGINEERING for more details.)\n\n=mantis=\n\n\n\n--"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0308-3873@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Michael Andre-Driussi",
        "address": "mantis at siriusfiction.com"
      },
      "date": "2003-08-08T15:03:33+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (urth) Thecla's fourth book",
      "in_reply_to": "<urth-v0308-3872@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Don Palumbo wrote:\nSo, is there any evidence in the text of the tetralogy itself that this 4th\nbook in THE BOOK OF THE NEW SUN?\n\nAnd where exactly can I find this essay in PLAN[E]T ENGINEERING?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "I will answer the last part: PLAN[E]T ENGINEERING is a book published by\nNESFA Press in 1984.  The first essay in this book is \"Books in THE BOOK OF\nTHE NEW SUN.\"  That is the essay I referred to.\n\n=mantis="
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}