{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4461",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 4461,
    "subject": "Outsider=Pas & Kypris?",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "2005-06-24T06:40:48+00:00",
    "last": "2005-06-24T13:06:43+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<27413698.1119619959842.JavaMail.root@wamui-karabash.atl.sa.earthlink.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "James Wynn",
        "address": "thewynns at earthlink.net"
      },
      "date": "2005-06-24T06:40:48+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Outsider=Pas & Kypris?",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Nastler says:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Before the old Gnostic argument cycles through again,\nI'd just like to flag the discovery of the secular\nnature of Silks enlightenment made by Marc Aramini\nalmost two years ago (10Oct2003) but not really\ndiscussed on the list."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Marc's argument is intriguing, but if Pas had the mental\nwherewithall to communicate with Silk so definitively on\nthe ball court and in Hotel garden, then I'm not sure why\nhe needed Awk, Silk, Sand, and Patera Jerboa. Kypris was\non the run, but Pas was \"killed\"....with relics of him\ndistributed in a few animals like Oreb, in chems, and in\nthe minds of a few people. \n\nMost important, in the Outsider's discussion with Silk at \nthe Hotel pool, he explicitly differentiates himself from the\nGods of the Whorl. He says they are *becoming* him by\nmimicking him (Remember Mint's argument that Spider's\nspies will have to fight and work like the most devoted\ncitizens so they will be trusted).\n\nThere are a lot of potential reasons why Silk hears male\nand female voices during his enlightenment even if we\ncould say for a fact that the voices were Pas's and Kypris's.\nFor example: Since Kypris was already *becoming* the\nOutsider and during 300 year voyage of the ship, Pas \nsurely was well along that process, the Outsider talked to\nthem in the voices of his images on the ship. \n\nBut there are other reasons for this in the themes and\nsymbols of Gnosticism and alchemy that Wolfe his riffing on. \n\n~ Crush"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<001301c578f8$3bf28820$1a3ec6d8@rclackey.stic.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Roy C. Lackey",
        "address": "rclackey at stic.net"
      },
      "date": "2005-06-24T13:06:43+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Outsider=Pas & Kypris?",
      "in_reply_to": "<27413698.1119619959842.JavaMail.root@wamui-karabash.atl.sa.earthlink.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Crush wrote:\nMarc's argument is intriguing, but if Pas had the mental\nwherewithall to communicate with Silk so definitively on\nthe ball court and in Hotel garden, then I'm not sure why\nhe needed Awk, Silk, Sand, and Patera Jerboa. Kypris was\non the run, but Pas was \"killed\"....with relics of him\ndistributed in a few animals like Oreb, in chems, and in\nthe minds of a few people."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Pas in Oreb? I don't think so. That was Scylla. (RTTW, 348)\n\n-Roy"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}