{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4600", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 4600, "subject": "Abaia & co.", "messages": 15, "voices": 10, "first": "2006-05-19T06:43:23+00:00", "last": "2006-05-20T19:53:13+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "<002b01c67b0f$8cd78be0$043ec6d8@rclackey.stic.net>", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "2006-05-19T06:43:23+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "mourning's glory quoted Dan'l and wrote:\nI do wonder about this. Is there any specific (textual) reason to\nsuppose that the Megatherians, at least some of them, _don't_\nsurvive the coming of the White Fountain? Thematically it makes\nsome sense, but it also makes thematic sense that at least some\n_do_ survive --" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Survive, yes; thrive, no. \"Their power surpasses understanding, and I know\nnow that they could crush us in a day if it were not that they count only\nenslavement, and not annihilation, as victory.\" So if a flood wiped out all\nof their current slaves (the Ascians), as well as most of their potential\nfuture ones (everyone else), they probably wouldn't even stay -- certainly,\nunless they were irretrievably stranded, they would have little reason to\nprolong their mission." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "This is one of those areas where Wolfe strains my credulity a tad thin. I\nmean, Abaia & co. are reputed to be literally as big as mountains. Even\nJonas affirmed that improbable size. I don't know if the upheaval of\ncontinents occasioned by the passage of the white fountain would harm a\n\"mountain\" or not, but if they did survive and wanted to leave Ushas, how\ncould something(s) that big ever get off the planet? If they did die with\nUrth, there must have been a monumental stench in the early days of Ushas.\n\nTyphon said something that implied that they had not been on Urth in his\nera. \"But I have lived almost a day [since Severian revived him] and have\nsent my thought into far places. There are powers in the seas now who would\nrule. They will become our slaves, and the hordes of the north are theirs.\"\n(SWORD. chapter XXVI) That \"now\" suggests to me that they were something new\nto him.\n\nThe undines as \"brides\" of Abaia strikes me as ludicrous unless bride is\nmeant metaphorically, in the sense that nuns are said to be brides of\nChrist. Juturna was big -- about sixty feet tall at the Cephissus -- but\nstill quite small in comparison to a mountain. Undines as sexual playthings?\nOn the last day of Urth, Baldanders had grown to about twelve feet tall, and\nthe rest of his body seemed to be in proportion to his height. His eardrums\nhad grown so thick he was almost deaf. Even so, as a sexual partner for\nJuturna, I don't think he would measure up.\n\nAs for Severian and Juturna; perhaps I lack sufficient imagination, but I\njust don't see him as being of much use to that scarlet-eyed hussy. \n\n-Roy" } ] }, { "message_id": "<20060519083226.99525.qmail@web54205.mail.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "nastler", "address": "nastler at yahoo.dk" }, "date": "2006-05-19T08:32:26+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<002b01c67b0f$8cd78be0$043ec6d8@rclackey.stic.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I'm enjoying the reheated discussion about Baldanders\nand the megatherians.\nBaldanders as a \"kind of baby Abia\" is an important\ntheory, but what if he IS Abia? This has been proposed\nbefore (I can't find the ref, but it must have been\nBorski, right?), and Sev as eventual Lake God\n(Oannes?)\n\n--- \"Roy C. Lackey\" skrev:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "mourning's glory quoted Dan'l and wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 4, "text": "I do wonder about this. Is there any specific\n(textual) reason to\nsuppose that the Megatherians, at least some of\nthem, _don't_\nsurvive the coming of the White Fountain?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Thematically it makes\nsome sense, but it also makes thematic sense\nthat at least some\n_do_ survive --" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Survive, yes; thrive, no. \"Their power surpasses\nunderstanding, and I know\nnow that they could crush us in a day if it were\nnot that they count only\nenslavement, and not annihilation, as victory.\" So\nif a flood wiped out all\nof their current slaves (the Ascians), as well as\nmost of their potential\nfuture ones (everyone else), they probably wouldn't\neven stay -- certainly,\nunless they were irretrievably stranded, they would\nhave little reason to\nprolong their mission." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "This is one of those areas where Wolfe strains my\ncredulity a tad thin. I\nmean, Abaia & co. are reputed to be literally as big\nas mountains. Even\nJonas affirmed that improbable size. I don't know if\nthe upheaval of\ncontinents occasioned by the passage of the white\nfountain would harm a\n\"mountain\" or not, but if they did survive and\nwanted to leave Ushas, how\ncould something(s) that big ever get off the planet?\nIf they did die with\nUrth, there must have been a monumental stench in\nthe early days of Ushas.\n\nTyphon said something that implied that they had not\nbeen on Urth in his\nera. \"But I have lived almost a day [since Severian\nrevived him] and have\nsent my thought into far places. There are powers in\nthe seas now who would\nrule. They will become our slaves, and the hordes of\nthe north are theirs.\"\n(SWORD. chapter XXVI) That \"now\" suggests to me that\nthey were something new\nto him.\n\nThe undines as \"brides\" of Abaia strikes me as\nludicrous unless bride is\nmeant metaphorically, in the sense that nuns are\nsaid to be brides of\nChrist. Juturna was big -- about sixty feet tall at\nthe Cephissus -- but\nstill quite small in comparison to a mountain.\nUndines as sexual playthings?\nOn the last day of Urth, Baldanders had grown to\nabout twelve feet tall, and\nthe rest of his body seemed to be in proportion to\nhis height. His eardrums\nhad grown so thick he was almost deaf. Even so, as a\nsexual partner for\nJuturna, I don't think he would measure up.\n\nAs for Severian and Juturna; perhaps I lack\nsufficient imagination, but I\njust don't see him as being of much use to that\nscarlet-eyed hussy. \n\n-Roy\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "b sharp", "address": "bsharporflat at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2006-05-19T12:27:11+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<20060519083226.99525.qmail@web54205.mail.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "So we are on undine mating habits, hm..I think Robert Borski is of the \nopinion that Baldanders mated with one of them, which gave him the ability \nto breath underwater. Severian acquired that ability also, so did he also \nmate?\n\nElephant seal males (up to 10,000 lbs) mate with females (closer to 1000 \nlbs) so maybe Baldanders and Juturna (yes, Diuturna) were able to do it. \nSeverian, well.....creates a very awkward visual, to say the least.\n\nSeverian does dream of undines when he first meets and sleeps with \nBaldanders. There is the suggestion that dream was originally intended for \nBaldanders but found a more enticing target. In Eschatology and Genesis we \nfind that Meschianne, Jahi and the Contessa are all competing to mate with \nMeschia (Severian) as the end of the world approaches. Perhaps Juturna \nwants to get in on the action? What exactly DID she want from him at the \nriver Cephissus? \"only your love, only your love....\"\n\nRegarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines \nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have grown big \nenough to mate with him.\n\n-bsharp" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "mournings glory", "address": "mourningsglory at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2006-05-19T15:43:05+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<20060519083226.99525.qmail@web54205.mail.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I'm enjoying the reheated discussion about Baldanders\nand the megatherians.\nBaldanders as a \"kind of baby Abia\" is an important\ntheory, but what if he IS Abia? This has been proposed\nbefore (I can't find the ref, but it must have been\nBorski, right?), and Sev as eventual Lake God\n(Oannes?)" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Could the giant baby found in Baldander's castle be the infant Abaia? As \nSeverian tells us, \"I left this boy where I had found him, and to this day I \nhave no notion of what may have become of him.\"\nPronouncements like this by Wolfean characters make me very suspicious, and \nif his mother is Juturna and experiences time backwards, he could evolve \nwiddershins fashion into Abaia -- a rather nice irony, if Severian is his \nfather. This would also make the undines mother-aunts more than \nsister-brides -- or maybe not, given the novel's many incestuous couplings." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "The undines as \"brides\" of Abaia strikes me as\nludicrous unless bride is\nmeant metaphorically, in the sense that nuns are\nsaid to be brides of\nChrist. Juturna was big -- about sixty feet tall at\nthe Cephissus -- but\nstill quite small in comparison to a mountain.\nUndines as sexual playthings?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Again, I think you're thinking too rigidly biological here. Severian couples \nwith Apheta, and their child is the White Fountain. Explain the genetics of \nthat one.\n\nRe 14 vs 17, and minotaur math:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I guess that makes more sense: 14 is as high as the Minotaur can\ncount. Ten fingers, two hooves, two horns." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "What? No pizzle? Guess that makes him related to Appian-the-bull in at least \ntwo respects, no?\n\nemotaur" } ] }, { "message_id": "<20060519160202.2057.qmail@web51114.mail.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "Macronaut", "address": "macronaut at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2006-05-19T16:02:02+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "The undines as \"brides\" of Abaia strikes me as\nludicrous unless bride is\nmeant metaphorically, in the sense that nuns are\nsaid to be brides of\nChrist. Juturna was big -- about sixty feet tall\nat\nthe Cephissus -- but\nstill quite small in comparison to a mountain.\nUndines as sexual playthings?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Again, I think you're thinking too rigidly\nbiological here. Severian couples \nwith Apheta, and their child is the White Fountain.\nExplain the genetics of " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I agree with that, and I don't think you even need to\nresort to stellar/metaphysical coupling, basic\nphysical biology will do. As a fan of H.P. Lovecraft,\nAbaia make me think of big Cthulhian monsters floating\naround in the sea with lots of psuedopods. Just\nbecause Abaia is the size of a mountain doesn't mean\nhis sexual organs need to be.\n\nNot to mention that if Tzadkiel can shed pieces to\nform smaller, more manageable versions of himself, a\nbig floating monster like Abaia might be able to as\nwell.\n\nSince everyone is on the subject of Megatherians these\ndays, did anyone ever solve the mystery of what the\ngiant walking thing was in the Saltus mine? Our only\nclues, as I recall, were:\n\n1) it took steps (or at least flopped around loudly)\n2) the man-apes were afraid of it (and therefore\nseemed to have some idea what it was)\n3) Severian thinks \"he now knows what it was\".\n\nDidn't he also ask Jonas about it, who had some idea\nbut wouldn't say?\n\nMacronaut" } ] }, { "message_id": "<200605191815.40376.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "from": { "name": "Daniel D Jones", "address": "ddjones at riddlemaster.org" }, "date": "2006-05-19T22:15:40+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 11:43, mournings glory wrote:\nRe 14 vs 17, and minotaur math:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "I guess that makes more sense: 14 is as high as the Minotaur can\ncount. Ten fingers, two hooves, two horns." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "What? No pizzle? Guess that makes him related to Appian-the-bull in at\nleast two respects, no?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Cattle have cloven hooves, too. Ten fingers, four hoof-parts(1), two horns, \none pizzle. 17. Would have worked out nicely. Too bad reality had to \nintrude.\n\n\n(1) What's the word for half of a cloven hoof? Wolfe probably knows it but I \ndon't." } ] }, { "message_id": "<200605191817.40849.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "from": { "name": "Daniel D Jones", "address": "ddjones at riddlemaster.org" }, "date": "2006-05-19T22:17:40+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<20060519160202.2057.qmail@web51114.mail.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 12:02, Macronaut wrote:\nSince everyone is on the subject of Megatherians these\ndays, did anyone ever solve the mystery of what the\ngiant walking thing was in the Saltus mine? Our only\nclues, as I recall, were:\n\n1) it took steps (or at least flopped around loudly)\n2) the man-apes were afraid of it (and therefore\nseemed to have some idea what it was)\n3) Severian thinks \"he now knows what it was\".\n\nDidn't he also ask Jonas about it, who had some idea\nbut wouldn't say?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I always thought it was a Talus, but I can't recall at the moment what \nconvinced me of that." } ] }, { "message_id": "<200605191824.22442.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "from": { "name": "Daniel D Jones", "address": "ddjones at riddlemaster.org" }, "date": "2006-05-19T22:24:22+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 08:27, b sharp wrote:\nSo we are on undine mating habits, hm..I think Robert Borski is of the\nopinion that Baldanders mated with one of them, which gave him the ability\nto breath underwater. Severian acquired that ability also, so did he also\nmate?\n\nElephant seal males (up to 10,000 lbs) mate with females (closer to 1000\nlbs) so maybe Baldanders and Juturna (yes, Diuturna) were able to do it.\nSeverian, well.....creates a very awkward visual, to say the least.\n\nSeverian does dream of undines when he first meets and sleeps with\nBaldanders. There is the suggestion that dream was originally intended for\nBaldanders but found a more enticing target. In Eschatology and Genesis we\nfind that Meschianne, Jahi and the Contessa are all competing to mate with\nMeschia (Severian) as the end of the world approaches. Perhaps Juturna\nwants to get in on the action? What exactly DID she want from him at the\nriver Cephissus? \"only your love, only your love....\"\n\nRegarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines\nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have grown big\nenough to mate with him." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Perhaps the approach is something like this:\n\n\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will draw staring \neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen and kiss \nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will praise \nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it not to go.\"" } ] }, { "message_id": "<200605191920.09241.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "from": { "name": "Daniel D Jones", "address": "ddjones at riddlemaster.org" }, "date": "2006-05-19T23:20:09+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<029E6302-9938-49F3-BD9D-30710C98E957@gmail.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 20:35, Matthew King wrote:\nOn May 19, 2006, at 3:24 PM, Daniel D Jones wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "Regarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines\nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have\ngrown big\nenough to mate with him." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Perhaps the approach is something like this:\n\n\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will\ndraw staring\neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen\nand kiss\nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will\npraise\nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it\nnot to go.\"" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "For those who don't immediately recognize the source, the quote is\nfrom the Wizard Knight. That's even scarier out of context than it\nwas in." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Scary? Probably not the adjective I would have chosen but it certainly \ndemonstrates that Wolfe doesn't necessarily consider gross discrepancies in \nsize to be a barrier to mating. " } ] }, { "message_id": "<029E6302-9938-49F3-BD9D-30710C98E957@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Matthew King", "address": "automatthew at gmail.com" }, "date": "2006-05-20T00:35:56+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<200605191824.22442.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "On May 19, 2006, at 3:24 PM, Daniel D Jones wrote:\nRegarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines\nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have \ngrown big\nenough to mate with him." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Perhaps the approach is something like this:\n\n\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will \ndraw staring\neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen \nand kiss\nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will \npraise\nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it \nnot to go.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "For those who don't immediately recognize the source, the quote is \nfrom the Wizard Knight. That's even scarier out of context than it \nwas in." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Adam Thornton", "address": "adam at io.com" }, "date": "2006-05-20T00:43:47+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<200605191815.40376.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On May 19, 2006, at 5:15 PM, Daniel D Jones wrote:\nOn Friday 19 May 2006 11:43, mournings glory wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Re 14 vs 17, and minotaur math:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "I guess that makes more sense: 14 is as high as the Minotaur can\ncount. Ten fingers, two hooves, two horns." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "What? No pizzle? Guess that makes him related to Appian-the-bull \nin at\nleast two respects, no?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Cattle have cloven hooves, too. Ten fingers, four hoof-parts(1), \ntwo horns,\none pizzle. 17. Would have worked out nicely. Too bad reality \nhad to\nintrude." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Reality SUCKS.\n\nWaaaah.\n\nAdam" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Transentient", "address": "transentient at gmail.com" }, "date": "2006-05-20T01:11:29+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<200605191824.22442.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On May 19, 2006, at 6:24 PM, Daniel D Jones wrote:\nOn Friday 19 May 2006 08:27, b sharp wrote\nRegarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines\nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have \ngrown big\nenough to mate with him.\n\nPerhaps the approach is something like this:\n\n\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will \ndraw staring\neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen \nand kiss\nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will \npraise\nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it \nnot to go.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "What I find most disturbing here is that this wouldn't result in \nimpregnation, unless the giant's semen behaved similarly to the \ngiant's blood.\n\nAnd I dearly wish I hadn't ever realized that..." } ] }, { "message_id": "<200605201405.35591.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "from": { "name": "Daniel D Jones", "address": "ddjones at riddlemaster.org" }, "date": "2006-05-20T18:05:34+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 21:11, Transentient wrote:\nOn May 19, 2006, at 6:24 PM, Daniel D Jones wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 08:27, b sharp wrote" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "Regarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines\nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have\ngrown big\nenough to mate with him." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Perhaps the approach is something like this:\n\n\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will\ndraw staring\neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen\nand kiss\nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will\npraise\nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it\nnot to go.\"" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "What I find most disturbing here is that this wouldn't result in\nimpregnation, unless the giant's semen behaved similarly to the\ngiant's blood.\n\nAnd I dearly wish I hadn't ever realized that..." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Not exactly dinner table conversation, is it? However, considering the \ncopious amount of semen that would be produced and the fact that the female \nis disrobed, I think it quite likely that a sperm could, ah, find it's way to \nthe appropriate location to cause conception. I'm reasonably certain that \nthere have been cases of pregnancy documented where no penetration occurred." } ] }, { "message_id": "<390521C2-54E0-4EE4-B89D-582A0CE63F9F@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Transentient", "address": "transentient at gmail.com" }, "date": "2006-05-20T19:23:17+00:00", "subject": "(urth) giant fluids", "in_reply_to": "<200605201405.35591.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will\ndraw staring\neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen\nand kiss\nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will\npraise\nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it\nnot to go.\"" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "What I find most disturbing here is that this wouldn't result in\nimpregnation, unless the giant's semen behaved similarly to the\ngiant's blood.\n\nAnd I dearly wish I hadn't ever realized that..." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Not exactly dinner table conversation, is it? However, considering \nthe\ncopious amount of semen that would be produced and the fact that \nthe female\nis disrobed, I think it quite likely that a sperm could, ah, find \nit's way to\nthe appropriate location to cause conception. I'm reasonably \ncertain that\nthere have been cases of pregnancy documented where no penetration \noccurred." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I appreciate the effort, but its like that bedroom closet door in the \nfirst Poltergeist movie that I saw when I was way too young - nothing \nis going to make me \"unimagine\" this bit of horror. :)\n\nGiant's blood is noted to be inhabited by numerous small loathesome \ncreatures. I get the impression that this fauna is not OF the giant, \nbut are more like parasites or symbiots of some kind. The giant's \nvital fluid is simply a microcosm of life.\n\nBut (correct me if I am misremembering), but the giants themselves \nrose from hacked-up bits of Angr herself originally, right? A bit of \nJohn Carpenter's visualization of The Thing going on here.\n\nSo which is it - is the blood of the Angrborn animated itself, is it \ninhabited by species of critter that are basically small organisms of \nthe same flesh as the giant, similar to how the Angrborn themselves \nare remnants of Angr, or are the organisms that dwell in the blood of \na giant some external species? Any thoughts?\n\nIn \"The Legend of Xi Cygnus\" from Innocents Aboard, which features a \ngiant much like the Angrborn, they are described as \"those small \ncreatures that dwell in the blood.\" It seems more like these are \nparasites or symbiots - they aren't PART of the giant, they just live \nin his veins. I am not sure how much connection between this short \nand Wizard Knight I should read into it, but in the short story, I \nwas left with the idea that the giant, the king, was symbolic of the \nEarth. And the dwarves were the human race, and the last line of the \nstory was a rejoinder to be gentle on her old bones. (Well, the giant \ncould be other things, too, that the human race has abused and \ndefiled at its own peril.)\n\nBut at any rate - should the semen of a giant be similarly inhabited \nby squirming wriggling things that would be active participants in \nthe consumation of a marriage between a giant and a human female, I \nwonder if they are actually OF the giant or merely creatures that \nlive there in his um..." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Tristan Davenport", "address": "tristan_davenport at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2006-05-20T19:53:13+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Abaia & co.", "in_reply_to": "<200605201405.35591.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "From: Daniel D Jones \nReply-To: The Urth Mailing List \nTo: The Urth Mailing List \nSubject: Re: (urth) Abaia & co.\nDate: Sat, 20 May 2006 14:05:34 -0400\n\nOn Friday 19 May 2006 21:11, Transentient wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "On May 19, 2006, at 6:24 PM, Daniel D Jones wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "On Friday 19 May 2006 08:27, b sharp wrote" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 4, "text": "Regarding mating with Abaia, I think also in that dream, the undines\nproclaim that they are daughter-brides waiting until they have\ngrown big\nenough to mate with him." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "Perhaps the approach is something like this:\n\n\"Disrobed, I will love it as if it were a dwarfish man. I will\ndraw staring\neyes and a smiling mouth. I will anoint it with sweet oils, cozen\nand kiss\nit, beg its love.... Erupting it will bathe me in semen, and I will\npraise\nand kiss the more, saying how happy it has made me and begging it\nnot to go.\"" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "What I find most disturbing here is that this wouldn't result in\nimpregnation, unless the giant's semen behaved similarly to the\ngiant's blood.\n\nAnd I dearly wish I hadn't ever realized that..." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Not exactly dinner table conversation, is it? However, considering the\ncopious amount of semen that would be produced and the fact that the female\nis disrobed, I think it quite likely that a sperm could, ah, find it's way \nto\nthe appropriate location to cause conception. I'm reasonably certain that\nthere have been cases of pregnancy documented where no penetration \noccurred." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Certainly there have, many involving hot tubs.\n\n~Tristan" } ] } ] }