{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4614", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 4614, "subject": "Speaking of Hierodules...", "messages": 4, "voices": 4, "first": "2006-05-24T23:00:59+00:00", "last": "2006-05-25T22:19:52+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Jeffrey Lefstin", "address": "jeff.lefstin at stanfordalumni.org" }, "date": "2006-05-24T23:00:59+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Speaking of Hierodules...", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I am abashed to reveal that I learned this from \"The Da Vinci Code,\" \nbut something that seems to have escaped attention:\n\nWolfe is misdirecting us a little when he tells us that \"hierodule\" \nmeans \"holy slave.\" The more specific meaning is \"temple prostitute\" \nin Greek and other pagan religions, and there's no way that's an \naccident. According to wikipedia, the act of sex with a hierodule was \nknown as \"hieros gamos\":\n\nHieros Gamos (Greek ????? ?????, \"holy wedding\") or Hierogamy (Greek \n?????????, again \"holy wedding\") means a coupling (sometimes marriage) \nof a god and a man or a woman, often having a symbolic meaning and \ngenerally conducted in the spring. It is an ancient ritual in which \nparticipants believed that they could gain profound religious \nexperience through sexual intercourse. Participants assumed \ncharacteristics of deities, often channeling the deities in question, \nand by their union provided symbolic and literal fertility for \nthemselves, the land, and their people. This was often done by the \nmonarch and hierodule of the dominant religion.\n\n\nWell, that's TBotNS in a nutshell. The fertility of Urth is restored \nby the sexual union of Severian (\"the monarch\") and Apheta, which \nconceives the New Sun. (In contrast to the union between Severian and \nValeria, who represents the old & raddled Urth). Yes, I know Apheta is \na larval hierogrammate, not a hierodule, but let's not get inconvenient \nfacts get in the way. Hierogrammates was an afterthought tacked on in \nUotNS, and besides, hierogrammate sounds a lot like \"hieros gamos.\"\n\n\nActually, in \"Da Vinci Code\" Brown talks about \"hieros gamos\" as a \nkabbalistic union of male and female practiced in ancient Jewish \nreligion, which would mate (ha, ha) quite well with the kabbalistic \ncontext of UotNS. But from what I gather Brown made that aspect up out \nof thin air.\n\nAnd please don't go read the \"Da Vinci Code\" on account of this. It is \na Really Really Lame piece of literature and you should read the \n\"non-fiction\" books if the whole grail/bloodline/conspiracy stuff \nintrigues you. You have been warned." } ] }, { "message_id": "<200605250723.45358.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "from": { "name": "Daniel D Jones", "address": "ddjones at riddlemaster.org" }, "date": "2006-05-25T11:23:45+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Speaking of Hierodules...", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Wednesday 24 May 2006 19:00, Jeffrey Lefstin wrote:\nAnd please don't go read the \"Da Vinci Code\" on account of this. It is\na Really Really Lame piece of literature and you should read the\n\"non-fiction\" books if the whole grail/bloodline/conspiracy stuff\nintrigues you. You have been warned." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Or, if you want fiction, try Umberto Eco's _Focault's Pendulum_." } ] }, { "message_id": "<003301c68032$f243fd60$4b3ec6d8@rclackey.stic.net>", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "2006-05-25T19:39:21+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Speaking of Hierodules...", "in_reply_to": "<200605250723.45358.ddjones@riddlemaster.org>", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Jeffrey Lefstin wrote:\nYes, I know Apheta is a larval hierogrammate, not a hierodule, but let's\nnot get inconvenient facts get in the way.<<" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Amen. Many a perfectly good theory has been ruined that way. \n\n-Roy" } ] }, { "message_id": "<20060525221952.81799.qmail@web32412.mail.mud.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "don doggett", "address": "kingwukong at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2006-05-25T22:19:52+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Speaking of Hierodules...", "in_reply_to": "<003301c68032$f243fd60$4b3ec6d8@rclackey.stic.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "--- \"Roy C. Lackey\" wrote:\nJeffrey Lefstin wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "Yes, I know Apheta is a larval hierogrammate, not\na hierodule, but let's\nnot get inconvenient facts get in the way.<<" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Amen. Many a perfectly good theory has been ruined\nthat way. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "But faith and fiction endure regardless. ]; )" } ] } ] }