{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4661", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 4661, "subject": "question about Soldier of Arete", "messages": 7, "voices": 6, "first": "2006-07-10T10:31:11+00:00", "last": "2006-07-11T18:37:28+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "<20060710103111.96422.qmail@web35914.mail.mud.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "stilskin", "address": "acronus at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2006-07-10T10:31:11+00:00", "subject": "(urth) question about Soldier of Arete", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I've just received a review copy of Sidon, and in\npreparation for it gone back over Mist and Arete. I\nremain baffled by what exactly transpires at the end\nof Arete to throw Latro into his depression. I feel\nsure this has been hashed out on the list in the past\nbut was hoping someone could give me an idea of what\nhappens at that crucial juncture. It's clearly a\nbetrayal of some kind, one that touches Latro at a\nlevel deeper than mere memory; or touches a deeper\nkind of memory. \n\n\n\nhttp://www.sff.net/people/stilskin" } ] }, { "message_id": "<000001c6a41c$52dafa40$a634290a@bluelnk.net>", "from": { "name": "Dave Lebling", "address": "dlebling at hyraxes.com" }, "date": "2006-07-10T12:28:17+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Soldier of Arete Answer", "in_reply_to": "<20060710103111.96422.qmail@web35914.mail.mud.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Stilskin asked:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I remain baffled by what exactly transpires at the end\nof Arete to throw Latro into his depression." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "http://mysite.verizon.net/~vze2tmhh/gwjbj3.html\n\nJim Jordan's interview with Wolfe (at the above link) answers your question.\nSearch for \"Sparta.\"\n\n-- Dave Lebling, aka Vizcacha" } ] }, { "message_id": "<20060710124226.61364.qmail@web35903.mail.mud.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "stilskin", "address": "acronus at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2006-07-10T12:42:26+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Soldier of Arete Answer", "in_reply_to": "<000001c6a41c$52dafa40$a634290a@bluelnk.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "--- Dave Lebling wrote:\nhttp://mysite.verizon.net/~vze2tmhh/gwjbj3.html\n\nJim Jordan's interview with Wolfe (at the above\nlink) answers your question.\nSearch for \"Sparta.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Very helpful, Dave -- many thanks! \n\nThat's what I thought happened, actually, but I\ncouldn't square it with the depth of Latro's\nsubsequent depression based on his reaction to similar\nand indeed even worse, in a more personal sense,\ntragedies and crimes that he witnesses and is involved\nin prior to that event. That disparity of affect made\nme suspect that I was missing a deeper and more\npersonal betrayal, perhaps something related to the\ncircumstances under which Latro lost his memory in the\nfirst place. It also seemed to be accompanied by, or\nsucceeded by, a definite shift in his feelings for Io,\none, again, that made me suspect there was more going\non than just her having finally finagled her way into\nhis bed.\n\nPaul" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<8628d821184b89ce1e1047528c5666e1@cogsci.ucsd.edu>", "from": { "name": "Adrian Robert", "address": "arobert at cogsci.ucsd.edu" }, "date": "2006-07-10T12:51:09+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Soldier of Arete Answer", "in_reply_to": "<000001c6a41c$52dafa40$a634290a@bluelnk.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Jul 10, 2006, at 8:28 AM, Dave Lebling wrote:\n\nStilskin asked:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "I remain baffled by what exactly transpires at the end\nof Arete to throw Latro into his depression." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "http://mysite.verizon.net/~vze2tmhh/gwjbj3.html\n\nJim Jordan's interview with Wolfe (at the above link) answers your \nquestion.\nSearch for \"Sparta.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Well regardless of what Wolfe himself says there about the Spartan \nceremony being the main antecedent, in real life there is rarely a \nsingle cause of depression, and the text certainly doesn't require \nLatro to be different. There are a number of events that despite his \nweakened memory cannot have failed to have a cumulative effect. The \nloss of Phareta, parting from various friends, the futile \npurposelessness with which he is tossed about by the winds of fate, ... \n It is a tribute to his strength of spirit (and of the human spirit) \nthat he carried on as long as he did." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Bob Miller", "address": "bob_bageera at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2006-07-11T07:12:51+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Soldier of Arete Answer", "in_reply_to": "<000001c6a41c$52dafa40$a634290a@bluelnk.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "dead link\n\n\nFrom: \"Dave Lebling\" \nReply-To: The Urth Mailing List \nTo: ,\"'The Urth Mailing List'\" \nSubject: (urth) Soldier of Arete Answer\nDate: Mon, 10 Jul 2006 08:28:17 -0400\n\n\nStilskin asked:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I remain baffled by what exactly transpires at the end\nof Arete to throw Latro into his depression." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "http://mysite.verizon.net/~vze2tmhh/gwjbj3.html\n\nJim Jordan's interview with Wolfe (at the above link) answers your question.\nSearch for \"Sparta.\"\n\n-- Dave Lebling, aka Vizcacha" } ] }, { "message_id": "<44B3536F.7070603@io.com>", "from": { "name": "Jeff Wilson", "address": "jwilson at io.com" }, "date": "2006-07-11T07:29:51+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Soldier of Arete Answer", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "From: \"Dave Lebling\" \nhttp://mysite.verizon.net/~vze2tmhh/gwjbj3.html" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Bob Miller wrote:\ndead link" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Works fine from here. Maybe if you gave up the evils of top-posting, the \nhierogrammates would allow you access." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Jeff Wilson - jwilson at io.com\n< http://www.io.com/~jwilson >" } ] }, { "message_id": "<1189.66.241.92.147.1152643048.squirrel@brunians.org>", "from": { "name": "brunians at brunians.org", "address": "brunians at brunians.org" }, "date": "2006-07-11T18:37:28+00:00", "subject": "(urth) question about Soldier of Arete", "in_reply_to": "<20060710103111.96422.qmail@web35914.mail.mud.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "The Spartans, under pretense of manumitting helots who had aided\nthe recent military victory, massacred them. Latro was a witness.\n\n\n.\n\n___" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I've just received a review copy of Sidon, and in\npreparation for it gone back over Mist and Arete. I\nremain baffled by what exactly transpires at the end\nof Arete to throw Latro into his depression. I feel\nsure this has been hashed out on the list in the past\nbut was hoping someone could give me an idea of what\nhappens at that crucial juncture. It's clearly a\nbetrayal of some kind, one that touches Latro at a\nlevel deeper than mere memory; or touches a deeper\nkind of memory.\n\n\n\nhttp://www.sff.net/people/stilskin\n\n__________________________________________________\nDo You Yahoo!?\nTired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around\nhttp://mail.yahoo.com\n_______________________________________________" } ] } ] }