Megatherian family tree The Urth list — 1 messages, 1 voices, 15 Aug 2006 https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4690 Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact. ============================================================================== b sharp — 15 Aug 2006, 18:29 Maybe that's a poor choice of name for this post since it is pretty hard to draw a family tree for very vaguely described creatures who can reproduce sexually or asexually. I mention sexual reproduction because the undines (in Severian's dream) say they are waiting to grow big enough to mate with Abaia. I mention asexual reproduction because I roundly think Urth of the New Sun was meant to flesh out the underdeveloped ideas in BotNS more than introduce new ideas. So when Tzadkiel is shown to break off a finger which reshapes itself into a human sized being, I think we are meant to understand the same thing has happened on Urth with large non-human creatures. Since we are also shown a tinker-bell sized Tzadkiel, I wonder if the giant Tzadkiels (male and female) that Severian meets are actually the largest versions. How big was the Tzadkiel Severian sees floating in space in the Autarch's mirror book? Mountain sized? Planet sized? Stellar sized? Anyway, from the skewed Theseus story, Severian recognizes the Naviscaput, with its ship-headed giant, as referring to Abaia. We do hear that this giant ogre raped a female being named Night. Elsewhere we find that Night is represented as pale skinned with a dark sable cloak. Also we are told that she later forgave the rape or decided it wasn't such a bad thing. I think Night is considered to be sister to the Naviscaput but I can't find that reference again. We aren't told much about Erebus, the other megatherian most often mentioned in the text after Abaia. Erebus was supposed to have had some sort of tiff with Abaia and retreated to the Antarctic ice with a retinue of pale warriors. Later there was a reconciliation and joining of forces of Abaia and Erebus. I think this reconcilliation is represented by the the strange sight reported by Maxellindis' Uncle: a huge ship on Gyoll carrying a crew of giant pale warriors. The pale skinned warriors and reconciliation make me think that Erebus (despite Erebus being referred to as "he" a couple times) is the Night found in the Naviscaput story. The fact that Erebus is the Greek god of Darkness could be seen as supporting evidence. I think, somehow from these two, Erebus and Abaia, other pagan god/monster/megatherian creatures were produced on Urth such as Arioch, Scylla, Amphisboena, Ourobouros and also the more human proportioned creatures like Juturna and Typhon and (I think) Father Inire. Aside from knowing he is a cacogen, I throw Father Inire in the mix because in the Naviscaput story we find a watery labyrinthine entranceway to his lair. Labyrinths always suggest Father Inire to me so I see a connection between him and Abaia. And through Father Inire I see the connection between Severian's family tree and the family of these alien, incestuous pagan god/megatherian creatures. That's it for my theory on Severian's family! I hope it was interesting in at least some way. -bsharp ------------------------------------------------------------------------------