# Chapter I *The Urth list — 5 messages, 5 voices, 07 Sep 2006* > Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright > in each message remains with the person who wrote it. > Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original > archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than > retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact. --- ### Wesley Parsons *07 Sep 2006, 12:37* Severian watches the fight between Vodalus and the volunteers over the shoulder of a "chalcedony angel." Chalcedony is typically a lustrous white quartz. Vodalus lives and two volunteers die. Later, in Urth of the New Sun, Sev makes love with Apheta, a lustrous silver angel, and the new sun is created. The fight in the graveyard may foreshadow the creation of the new sun. --- ### Dan'l Danehy-Oakes *08 Sep 2006, 01:42 · in reply to Wesley Parsons* > On 9/7/06, Wesley Parsons wrote: > The fight in the graveyard may > foreshadow the creation of the new sun. If so, it's a sort of ex post facto foreshadowing (oy, what a concept); Wolfe almost certainly didn't invent Apheta or that particular way of creating a star until Hartwell prevailed upon him to write the sequel. ``` Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, writer, trainer, bon vivant ----- http://www.livejournal.com/users/sturgeonslawyer http://www.danehyoakes.com I've got a piece of braaaaain lodge in me heeead!!! ``` --- ### stilskin *08 Sep 2006, 11:39 · in reply to Dan'l Danehy-Oakes* > --- Dan'l Danehy-Oakes wrote: > If so, it's a sort of ex post facto foreshadowing > (oy, what > a concept); Wolfe almost certainly didn't invent > Apheta > or that particular way of creating a star until > Hartwell > prevailed upon him to write the sequel. As a writer myself, who's discussed this point with a lot of other writers, I can tell you that this sort of "ex post facto foreshadowing" happens quite often. It's a result of what Steven King calls "the boys in the basement" going about their work and producing what the author needs not only in the current chapter or book, but beyond what he or she has consciously planned for the future of the project. The wondrous feeling, "So *that's* what I was up to!" is one of the real delights of writing fiction. Paul http://www.sff.net/people/stilskin --- ### Mo Holkar *08 Sep 2006, 12:05 · in reply to Dan'l Danehy-Oakes* > At 02:42 08/09/2006, Dan'l wrote: > If so, it's a sort of ex post facto foreshadowing (oy, what a > concept); Wolfe almost certainly didn't invent Apheta or that > particular way of creating a star until Hartwell prevailed upon him > to write the sequel. I guess this process is the opposite of retconning (retroactively creating / changing historical continuity, as is popular in the comics world). "Foreconning" maybe? Mo --- ### Jeff Wilson *08 Sep 2006, 16:01 · in reply to Mo Holkar* > Mo Holkar wrote: > At 02:42 08/09/2006, Dan'l wrote: >> If so, it's a sort of ex post facto foreshadowing (oy, what a >> concept); Wolfe almost certainly didn't invent Apheta or that >> particular way of creating a star until Hartwell prevailed upon him >> to write the sequel. > I guess this process is the opposite of retconning (retroactively > creating / changing historical continuity, as is popular in the > comics world). "Foreconning" maybe? "motif" ---