{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4755", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 4755, "subject": "Career of Severian as Conciliator", "messages": 3, "voices": 3, "first": "2006-10-25T21:55:35+00:00", "last": "2006-10-26T04:25:37+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan Rabin", "address": "wolfe-lists at danrabin.com" }, "date": "2006-10-25T21:55:35+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Career of Severian as Conciliator", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "At 2:21 PM -0600 10/25/06, Jack Redelfs wrote:\nI found his on-screen turn as the Conciliator to be quite\nunderwhelming. I just expected more. He carreer as Conciliator\nlasted for, 1 day, was it?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I don't think the narrative of _The Urth of the New Sun_ covers all \nappearances of Severian as the Conciliator:\n\n1. I recall a couple of references in _The Book of the New Sun_ \n(spoken by ?Typhon, ?Agia) to the Conciliator having disappeared and \nreappeared.\n\n2. In _Urth_, Severian wonders how many of the guests at the inn \nwhere he fights the zombie are him. At the time of his writing in \nUshas, at least, he seems to assume either that he's going to do a \nlot more walking in the Corridors of Time, or that more replicas will \nbe constructed in different threads of the tapestry of time.\n\n...and I just noticed a Wolfean inversion between _Book of the_ and \n_Urth of the_: In _Citadel_, Severian becomes the Autarch, \"who in \none body is a thousand\" (ch. 27); whereas in _Urth_ his one person is \ndispersed into a succession of bodies.\n\nCould we have the opinions of our knowledgeable Christian \ncontributors on how these two details might reflect religious themes?\n\n -- Dan Rabin" } ] }, { "message_id": "<1f7617370610251530m238971b9of62062ed371c46b5@mail.gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "danldo at gmail.com" }, "date": "2006-10-25T22:30:52+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Career of Severian as Conciliator", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 10/25/06, Dan Rabin wrote:\nCould we have the opinions of our knowledgeable Christian\ncontributors on how these two details might reflect religious themes?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Well, the first thing that comes to my mind is the 'miracle of bilocation,'\nwhereby various Catholic saints have been known to appear in two or\nmore places at the same time. (The first example I can think of is is\nPadre Pio.)\n\nAlso, Jesus was known to mysteriously disappear from amongst\ncrowds and show up somewhere else.\n\nYou've also made me to wonder whether Wolfe, or you, were making\na slight Heinlein reference:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "2. In _Urth_, Severian wonders how many of the guests at the inn\nwhere he fights the zombie are him." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Somehow this made me think of RAH's time-travel classic,\n\"All You Zombies--\"" }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, writer, trainer, bon vivant\n-----\nhttp://www.livejournal.com/users/sturgeonslawyer\nhttp://www.danehyoakes.com\nTragedy is when I cut my finger. Comedy is when you walk into an open\nsewer and die.\n - Mel Brooks" } ] }, { "message_id": "<454038C1.7000108@io.com>", "from": { "name": "Jeff Wilson", "address": "jwilson at io.com" }, "date": "2006-10-26T04:25:37+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Career of Severian as Conciliator", "in_reply_to": "<1f7617370610251530m238971b9of62062ed371c46b5@mail.gmail.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes wrote:\nOn 10/25/06, Dan Rabin wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Could we have the opinions of our knowledgeable Christian\ncontributors on how these two details might reflect religious themes?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Well, the first thing that comes to my mind is the 'miracle of bilocation,'\nwhereby various Catholic saints have been known to appear in two or\nmore places at the same time. (The first example I can think of is is\nPadre Pio.)\n\nAlso, Jesus was known to mysteriously disappear from amongst\ncrowds and show up somewhere else.\n\nYou've also made me to wonder whether Wolfe, or you, were making\na slight Heinlein reference:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "2. In _Urth_, Severian wonders how many of the guests at the inn\nwhere he fights the zombie are him." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Somehow this made me think of RAH's time-travel classic,\n\"All You Zombies--\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "There's never more than two of the protagonist at once in \"Zombies\", and \n\"By His Bootstraps\" only gets up to three. The earliest mention of mass \ntime duplicates I've found so far was a Poul Anderson short." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Jeff Wilson - jwilson at io.com\n< http://www.io.com/~jwilson >" } ] } ] }