{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/4918", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 4918, "subject": "Blood 'n' gods", "messages": 3, "voices": 3, "first": "2007-10-05T07:16:24+00:00", "last": "2007-10-05T15:15:51+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "<000c01c8071f$a6e400c0$46ca5a42@rclackey.stic.net>", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "2007-10-05T07:16:24+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Blood 'n' gods", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Recently I wrote:\nDisiri is the only Aelf to\nreceive a soul (if she did) we are shown in the text. Able's blood *seemed*\nto be the medium. Baki got Toug's blood, but I don't see that she gained a\nsoul by it. The only differences I can see are love and Able's status as a\ngod." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I should amend that to say that Able's blood enabled Disiri to become human;\na soul comes with the body. But the different results from the blood\ninfusions remain.\n\nA number of people seem to think that love is what accounted for the\ndifference. Maybe so, but I am not convinced.\n\nBaki was injured in consequence of service to Able. She came looking for\nAble to heal her, and she had earlier healed Able with her blood. Able was\nethically if not morally obligated to return the favor. He could do it, and\nshe knew he could do it, but he refused to do it *personally*, saying that\nhe *could not* do it. He discharged his obligation by getting Toug to heal\nher.\n\nAble wasn't exactly lying, but he wasn't quite truthful, either. He *could*\ndo it but elected not to. After a chapter and a half, he finally told Toug\nthe why of it. He had sworn an oath to The Valfather not to use the god-like\npowers (the authority of Skai) of an Overcyn while in Mythgarthr. \"I no\nlonger have the authority of Mythgarthr. That can never be mine again. My\nauthority's that of Skai.\" (W, 56) It was okay for Toug to heal Baki because\nhe was a god to her.\n\nAble can get away with that on a technicality, the proper relation of god to\nsupplicant in the Seven Worlds. But why make a big deal out of it? Any human\ncould have healed her, so how would healing her himself have violated his\noath, unless there was some property peculiar to Overcyn blood that would\nhave yielded a result different from that of human blood? Able did not love\nBaki anymore than Toug did, so that is not the answer.\n\nAt the end, after Able had broken his oath and healed some people, and just\nbefore The Valfather spoke to him, he was exhausted and said that he \"could\nheal no more.\" He had exhausted his Overcyn magic, but he still had Overcyn\nblood. He gave it to an Aelf and the Aelf became a human woman.\n\n-Roy" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Cliff Judge", "address": "transentient at gmail.com" }, "date": "2007-10-05T12:51:08+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Blood 'n' gods", "in_reply_to": "<000c01c8071f$a6e400c0$46ca5a42@rclackey.stic.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 10/5/07, Roy C. Lackey wrote:\n\n\nAt the end, after Able had broken his oath and healed some people, and\njust\nbefore The Valfather spoke to him, he was exhausted and said that he\n\"could\nheal no more.\" He had exhausted his Overcyn magic, but he still had\nOvercyn\nblood. He gave it to an Aelf and the Aelf became a human woman." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Okay, so if you are given the blood of someone from two steps higher than\nyou in the hierarchy, you can move up a level!\n\nSo if part of Dsiri's personal motivation in the story was to gain a soul,\nthen she must have meant for Able to be elevated to Overcyn from the very\nbeginning." } ] }, { "message_id": "<60A17993-B7CF-4DC5-8EC1-EB565D4B3AA7@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Matthew King", "address": "automatthew at gmail.com" }, "date": "2007-10-05T15:15:51+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Blood 'n' gods", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Oct 5, 2007, at 7:51 AM, Cliff Judge wrote:\nOkay, so if you are given the blood of someone from two steps \nhigher than you in the hierarchy, you can move up a level!" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "This raises the question of what happens when you are given the flesh \nand blood of the Most High God." } ] } ] }