# AEG: Gideon *The Urth list — 13 messages, 6 voices, 04 Jan 2009* > Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright > in each message remains with the person who wrote it. > Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original > archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than > retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact. --- ### Roy C. Lackey *04 Jan 2009, 23:00* > Dave Tallman wrote: > Reis seems to have brought his troubles on himself. Chase didn't make > him set the Navy on the Storm King. His only responsibility is that Reis > wouldn't have loved Cassie (and wanted to attack those who endangered > her) without Chase's help. Cassie surely cannot want revenge for that. I agree. I still wonder who shot Gid or, more to the point, who was behind the shooter. Gid had a late breakfast with Cassie the morning after the cast party. At about that time, Reis took the poison bracelet back from Margaret. Gid was shot early in the afternoon after dropping Cassie off at her apartment. Within 24 hours after being shot, he learned that Reis was looking for him to give him some help. So did Reis have a change of heart, as he did with Cassie, but too late to call off the shooter? Then why lie to Cassie about not being responsible for the shooting and tell her that he would find out who the shooter was? Also, Reis claimed that he preferred to win people over to him, rather than kill them. On a related note, apparently some time during the three-month gap between plays, he hired Gid's services at an even higher fee than for a past consultation. Exactly what did he hire Gid to do? Deliver Cassie to him by buying off Gid's affection for her? -Roy --- ### Dave Tallman *05 Jan 2009, 11:21 · in reply to Roy C. Lackey* > Roy C. Lackey wrote: > I still wonder who shot Gid or, more to the point, who was behind the > shooter. Gid had a late breakfast with Cassie the morning after the cast > party. At about that time, Reis took the poison bracelet back from Margaret. > Gid was shot early in the afternoon after dropping Cassie off at her > apartment. Within 24 hours after being shot, he learned that Reis was > looking for him to give him some help. So did Reis have a change of heart, > as he did with Cassie, but too late to call off the shooter? Then why lie to > Cassie about not being responsible for the shooting and tell her that he > would find out who the shooter was? Also, Reis claimed that he preferred to > win people over to him, rather than kill them. > Chase told Cassie his best ideas on who shot him on pp. 203-204. 1) He was convinced it wasn't Reis, that Reis only wanted to get him medical help and enlist him. Chase must have been certain of this or he wouldn't have been working for Reis. 2) Chase didn't think it was the FBI because: they are better shots, they only use violence when they have no choice, and they want him alive and active. That leaves two other major players, who may be the same: ATF and the Squiddies. Both use violence without caution: the deaths of Norma Peiper and Brian Pickens show that. The ATF might be poor shots (if Scott was lying and Cassie was the intended victim). The Squiddie assassin "Diana Diamond" was definitely a poor shot (p. 252-253), since she fired multiple times without killing anyone. She's a good candidate for Chase's shooter. She admits to killing Brian Pickens, so she was in Kingsport. I was hoping there would be a description of a facial scar that could have come from a cleaver, but no such luck. Cthulhu recruits may heal quickly. > On a related note, apparently some time during the three-month gap between > plays, he hired Gid's services at an even higher fee than for a past > consultation. Exactly what did he hire Gid to do? Deliver Cassie to him by > buying off Gid's affection for her? > Chase admitted to being hired to deliver Cassie, but not to loss of affection for her. He told her he loved her (p. 201). He just seemed to think Reis was winning in that department, and was surprised by Cassie's kiss and her offer to let him spend the night. --- ### Roy C. Lackey *05 Jan 2009, 19:09 · in reply to Dave Tallman* > Dave Tallman wrote: > That leaves two other major players, who may be the same: ATF and the > Squiddies. Both use violence without caution: the deaths of Norma Peiper > and Brian Pickens show that. The ATF might be poor shots (if Scott was > lying and Cassie was the intended victim). The Squiddie assassin "Diana > Diamond" was definitely a poor shot (p. 252-253), since she fired > multiple times without killing anyone. She's a good candidate for > Chase's shooter. She admits to killing Brian Pickens, so she was in > Kingsport. I was hoping there would be a description of a facial scar > that could have come from a cleaver, but no such luck. Cthulhu recruits > may heal quickly. But Gid saw the shooter and said it was a man. (203) >> On a related note, apparently some time during the three-month gap >> between >> plays, he hired Gid's services at an even higher fee than for a past >> consultation. Exactly what did he hire Gid to do? Deliver Cassie to him >> by >> buying off Gid's affection for her? > Chase admitted to being hired to deliver Cassie, but not to loss of > affection for her. He told her he loved her (p. 201). He just seemed to > think Reis was winning in that department, and was surprised by Cassie's > kiss and her offer to let him spend the night. Yes, Gid professed his love for her in his note (216), and he may even have been sincere, in his fashion. What I meant was that, even at the surface level, Gid subordinated his regard for her to his ambitions. No man who really loves a woman is complicit in delivering her for marriage to another man. Cassie realized that in her last conversation with him (228), when he offered excuses for not coming to pick her up in the islands. Reis didn't hire Gid, at great cost, to chauffeur Cassie to the islands. Anyone could have done that. Besides, Gid said that he had been hired as a temporary "consultant". (197) Gid had a reputation for getting things done that others couldn't do. What did Reis really want from him? -Roy --- ### Adam Thornton *05 Jan 2009, 19:14 · in reply to Roy C. Lackey* > On Jan 5, 2009, at 1:09 PM, Roy C. Lackey wrote: > No man who really loves a woman is complicit in delivering her for > marriage to another man. I take exception. Even apart from polygynous cases, it strikes me that this could be a magnificent theme for a story, and one that I'm sure has been done (indeed, it's done in Stephenson's Baroque Cycle, after a fashion) many times. For example: the low-born lover sets up the object of his adoration so that she may marry into money or power, after which she may poison her husband (or indeed, allow him to die a natural death if he is much older than she) so that she may then marry the low-born lover and drag him into a higher social or economic sphere. Sounds like it could be a fun read. Adam --- ### Marc Aramini *05 Jan 2009, 23:13 · follows Adam Thornton* Roy stated the person who shot gideon was a man. A while ago I thought the male dancer in the play with the initials d d who was described as "not a man" could be diana diamond but I need to read it again with that in mind. --- ### Dave Tallman *05 Jan 2009, 23:52 · follows Marc Aramini* > Marc Aramini wrote: > Roy stated the person who shot gideon was a man. A while ago I thought the male dancer in the play with the initials d d who was described as "not a man" could be diana diamond but I > need to read it again with that in mind The gender of the Takanga Ha'i assassin is highly ambiguous. The doctor says it was once human and female, but that his opinion hardly matters. Chase may have been mistaken in thinking his attacker was a man. The case for Donny Duke's connection with the assassin is good: 1) "In real life Donny Duke was small and swishy..." p. 53. He is later described as "not a man." 2) The assassin is a "little bit of a thing." p. 256. 2) Duke plays an assassin in "Red Spot" p. 63. 3) The actor who played the King Kanoa character in "Dating the Volcano God" played a character who hired Duke as Cassie's assassin in "Red Spot". 3) He likes thick green drinks (63,64). The assassin has thick green spit (252). 4) The common initials equals common identity game: both are known by D.D. On the other hand: 1) "Diana" she has never tried to "tread the boards" as an actor. 2) "Diana" says she didn't see Cassie's performance in which she danced a hornpipe in a scanty costume (250). Cassie's partner in that dance was Donny Duke (131). One of her fellow cult members did see that performance, and that could well be Duke. The assassin could be lying, of course. The connecting clues are so good that I hate to give up the theory on her say-so alone. Duke's face had red pimples, and the assassin's was very white, but this could be the result of cultish transformations. --- ### brunians at brunians.org *06 Jan 2009, 01:19 · in reply to Dave Tallman* Getting hit in the face with a meataxe is not a subtle thing. . > Marc Aramini wrote: >> Roy stated the person who shot gideon was a man. A while ago I thought >> the male dancer in the play with the initials d d who was described as >> "not a man" could be diana diamond but I > need to read it >> again with that in mind > The gender of the Takanga Ha'i assassin is highly ambiguous. The > doctor says it was once human and female, but that his opinion hardly > matters. Chase may have been mistaken in thinking his attacker was a > man. > > The case for Donny Duke's connection with the assassin is good: > 1) "In real life Donny Duke was small and swishy..." p. 53. He is > later described as "not a man." > 2) The assassin is a "little bit of a thing." p. 256. > 2) Duke plays an assassin in "Red Spot" p. 63. > 3) The actor who played the King Kanoa character in "Dating the > Volcano God" played a character who hired Duke as Cassie's assassin in > "Red Spot". > 3) He likes thick green drinks (63,64). The assassin has thick green spit > (252). > 4) The common initials equals common identity game: both are known by D.D. > > On the other hand: > 1) "Diana" she has never tried to "tread the boards" as an actor. > 2) "Diana" says she didn't see Cassie's performance in which she > danced a hornpipe in a scanty costume (250). Cassie's partner in that > dance was Donny Duke (131). One of her fellow cult members did see > that performance, and that could well be Duke. > > The assassin could be lying, of course. The connecting clues are so > good that I hate to give up the theory on her say-so alone. Duke's > face had red pimples, and the assassin's was very white, but this > could be the result of cultish transformations. > _______________________________________________ --- ### John Watkins *06 Jan 2009, 03:04 · in reply to Dave Tallman* Wouldn't even have to be a lie per se... "I never saw you onstage (from the audience)". > On 1/5/09, Dave Tallman wrote: > Marc Aramini wrote: >> Roy stated the person who shot gideon was a man. A while ago I thought >> the male dancer in the play with the initials d d who was described as >> "not a man" could be diana diamond but I > need to read it again >> with that in mind > The gender of the Takanga Ha'i assassin is highly ambiguous. The > doctor says it was once human and female, but that his opinion hardly > matters. Chase may have been mistaken in thinking his attacker was a > man. > > The case for Donny Duke's connection with the assassin is good: > 1) "In real life Donny Duke was small and swishy..." p. 53. He is > later described as "not a man." > 2) The assassin is a "little bit of a thing." p. 256. > 2) Duke plays an assassin in "Red Spot" p. 63. > 3) The actor who played the King Kanoa character in "Dating the > Volcano God" played a character who hired Duke as Cassie's assassin in > "Red Spot". > 3) He likes thick green drinks (63,64). The assassin has thick green spit > (252). > 4) The common initials equals common identity game: both are known by D.D. > > On the other hand: > 1) "Diana" she has never tried to "tread the boards" as an actor. > 2) "Diana" says she didn't see Cassie's performance in which she > danced a hornpipe in a scanty costume (250). Cassie's partner in that > dance was Donny Duke (131). One of her fellow cult members did see > that performance, and that could well be Duke. > > The assassin could be lying, of course. The connecting clues are so > good that I hate to give up the theory on her say-so alone. Duke's > face had red pimples, and the assassin's was very white, but this > could be the result of cultish transformations. > _______________________________________________ --- ### Dave Tallman *06 Jan 2009, 12:13 · in reply to John Watkins* > John Watkins wrote: > Wouldn't even have to be a lie per se... "I never saw you onstage > (from the audience)". > The other statement is not exactly a lie either. "An actress with no more vocal control than that? Perhaps I may tread the boards myself someday. I couldn't be worse" (p. 250). It doesn't really say that "Diana" never acted. The phrase "tread the boards" is old-fashioned theatrical slang. Vince Palma uses it on p. 63, "It was a privilege and an honor to tread the boards in your distinguished company." Perhaps Donny the assassin picked up the phrase from him. It's interesting that at the party Cassie ends up at a table with Vince, Margaret, Norma, and Donny, all of whom I have suspected of having plot-related secrets: Vince (Possessed by the Volcano God? Wearing invisible headdress?) Norma (Ex-wife of Reis? Plotted with ATF?) Margaret (Werewolf? Spy? Jewel thief? Seller of pictures to tabloids/internet?) Donny (Cthulhu cultist? Assassin? Shooter of Chase?) --- ### Dave Tallman *06 Jan 2009, 12:26 · in reply to brunians at brunians.org* > brunians wrote: > Getting hit in the face with a meataxe is not a subtle thing. > That's the biggest flaw I see with Donny as Chase's shooter. He has to appear in rehearsals for "Dating the Volcano God" very soon after the attack, and a big face wound would would be obvious. But he is an actor and would have access to advanced makeup technology. It's doubtful that his red pimples show in his stage roles, for example. You might have a pimply killer Seurat, but a pimply dancer in a musical would be strange. The fact that Cassie doesn't recognize Donny as the assassin by face or voice is more easily explained. The assassin may have been transformed by the Squid God -- maybe this was necessary for finally healing the axe wound, and removing the pimples was a side-effect. The assassin was probably good at voices, since she critiqued Cassie's vocal control. --- ### Dave Tallman *06 Jan 2009, 12:39 · in reply to Roy C. Lackey* > Roy C. Lackey wrote: > Reis didn't hire Gid, at great cost, to chauffeur Cassie to the islands. > Anyone could have done that. Besides, Gid said that he had been hired as a > temporary "consultant". (197) Gid had a reputation for getting things done > that others couldn't do. What did Reis really want from him? > One advantage of hiring Gid was that it divided his loyalties. He couldn't deliver Reis to the FBI while taking his money (202). But there must be something big going on in the background, too. Reis had a strong motivation for joining Cassie on the island, but he let her stay there alone for a long time. Since he hopped from Europe to see her early on, it's hard to see what could be keeping him away. He could at least spend some nights. I suspect it was something off-planet, maybe even in Woldercan. When Cassie called Chase he said it would be difficult to get to her (p. 228). Was he also off-planet? Maybe, since there's something strange about the phone service on the Takanga Islands (the time-shift we noticed for the call to Sharon). Perhaps calls are routed through Woldercan, and that's how Cassie was able to get the call through to him. --- ### Adam Thornton *06 Jan 2009, 21:41 · in reply to Adam Thornton* I am suddenly very afraid. http://edition.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/06/driving.obama/index.html?eref=rss_topstories It's a big black car. "And it will fix you a latte if you ask"[*] Now, whose car does THAT sound like? That's right. The new President. Whom, one must not forget, a popular[**] song just called "Magic." Adam [*] Not really, more's the pity...or WILL it? [**] In some circles, anyway. --- ### Roy C. Lackey *07 Jan 2009, 18:35 · in reply to Dave Tallman* > Dave Tallman wrote: > When Cassie called Chase he said it would be difficult to get to her (p. > 228). Was he also off-planet? Maybe, since there's something strange > about the phone service on the Takanga Islands (the time-shift we > noticed for the call to Sharon). Perhaps calls are routed through > Woldercan, and that's how Cassie was able to get the call through to him. If real-time phone service between planets light-years apart were even possible, the government would know and use it. Clearly it is not. Besides, what could either Reis or Chase have been doing on Woldercan during the week or so that Cassie was left to cool her heels in the islands that would have benefited either man's immediate agenda? -Roy ---