{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/5495", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 5495, "subject": "AEG: Bill's wives", "messages": 9, "voices": 3, "first": "2009-09-26T17:29:07+00:00", "last": "2009-10-02T04:06:10+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "<001101ca3ece$dd99a6e0$cfce4a0c@rclackey>", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "2009-09-26T17:29:07+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Judging from Klauser's picture, Bill Reis had a wife but no children by her\nwhen he first went to Woldercan as ambassador. He was ambassador for eight\nyears. In the year he met Cassie, he seems to have been back on Earth for\nsomething more than two years; call it three. Rian was then sixteen. That\nwould make Rian about five when Bill became ambassador, eleven years\nearlier.\n\nSo, Rian's mother must have been Bill's first wife, and the wife he had when\nhe went to Woldercan was his second. Judging from the picture comments about\nthe South Seas he made when he was replaced as ambassador, he had no wife\nwhen he returned to Earth, or if he did he would soon be quit of her. Either\nway, there is a good chance that the second wife was wealthy Madame\nPavlatos.\n\nThough we know little of Pavlatos, I think what we do know matches up well\nwith what we know about Cassie: both liked to sleep late, both were skinny\nwhen they met, both had once been great beauties, and neither liked for\npeople around them to cry. There is a contradiction about Pavlatos: she\narrived on a fancy yacht with an oversized stateroom, yet is described as\naustere. She was mistress of a billion dollars and comforted broken Cassie\nlike a mother. Klauser wondered if broken Cassie was starlet Cassie's\nmother.\n\nIf Cassie went to Woldercan to find Bill, how could she have known that such\na thing was even possible? Ethermails arriving out of sequence *suggest*\nthat the flow of time is not always linear. Still, time travel is not\ndemonstrated in the story, and Cassie is not all that bright. But she may\nhave had proof of it. If Pavlatos is an older Cassie, Cassie may have\nrecognized herself. Or, Pavlatos may have told her. Chance alone is not\nenough for Pavlatos to have been in the right place at the right time to\nrescue Cassie.\n\nIt may have unfolded this way: Cassie went to Woldercan as planned. She\n*had* to go there because of the ethermail she got from Gideon telling her\nit was okay to come. She had to send an ethermail telling him she was\ncoming. To do otherwise would invite those problematic \"complications\". If\nunaccounted for ethermails can cause problems, trips into the past that have\nnot yet been made would cause even bigger problems. So she went to Woldercan\nand Gideon used his magic to make her beautiful again, though probably not\nas beautiful as she had been. She hopped back to Earth and arrived before\nshe left, after the birth of Rian but before Bill was appointed ambassador.\n\nShe met and married Bill, who would then have been about her own age, and\nwent to Woldercan with him as his wife. Bill was a known womanizer, with a\nweakness for beautiful women. As her new-found beauty began to fade or the\nnovelty wore off, he lost interest in her. They broke up, and he paid a\nsteep price to be rid of her. That was the basis of the Pavlatos fortune.\n\nCassie went back to Earth and took the name Pavlatos. She knew exactly when,\nwhere and how Bill would die, but there was nothing she could do about it.\nShe knew exactly where to find Cassie, her younger self. She had to wait all\nthose months for Cassie to be broken, otherwise she herself would not have\nexisted as she was. In other words, she was stuck in a time loop. Everything\n*must* play out exactly as it *had* played out in her past.\n\nIt is not a \"happily ever after\" ending, but there was never going to be\none. Cassie's beauty would have faded anyway, no matter what happened to\nBill, and he was too self-centered and ego-bound to have stayed with a faded\nrose. Cassie was aware of Bill's fickle nature, having experienced it as his\nsecond wife. There may have been an element of vindictiveness in her passive\nrole as Pavlatos, or at least resignation.\n\n-Roy" } ] }, { "message_id": "<4AC222B6.7090200@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Dave Tallman", "address": "davetallman at msn.com" }, "date": "2009-09-29T15:07:34+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": "<001101ca3ece$dd99a6e0$cfce4a0c@rclackey>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Roy C. Lackey wrote:\nJudging from Klauser's picture, Bill Reis had a wife but no children by her\nwhen he first went to Woldercan as ambassador. He was ambassador for eight\nyears. In the year he met Cassie, he seems to have been back on Earth for\nsomething more than two years; call it three. Rian was then sixteen. That\nwould make Rian about five when Bill became ambassador, eleven years\nearlier.\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "This theory keeps the best of the Cassie/Pavlatos connection without the \nextra complications of time-travel to get Rian's age right. I think it's \ngood as far as it goes (I still want the Cassie/Margaret connection).\n\nDoes Pavlatos alone account for the reality-warping around Cassie \n(addresses, changes in what she remembers)? Or are there more \ntime-travelers to worry about? Bill's travels in time are pretty well \nestablished (he couldn't have put together a play to trap her without \nmore time). Is reality warping to keep things on track, the \"If I don't \nsend mine, his will have to be accounted for in some other way and it's \nliable to get complicated\" of a universe that fights back against paradoxes?" } ] }, { "message_id": "<001901ca4137$b3e1b200$2dce4a0c@rclackey>", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "2009-09-29T19:04:35+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": "<4AC222B6.7090200@gmail.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Dave Tallman quoted and wrote:\nJudging from Klauser's picture, Bill Reis had a wife but no children by\nher\nwhen he first went to Woldercan as ambassador. He was ambassador for\neight\nyears. In the year he met Cassie, he seems to have been back on Earth\nfor\nsomething more than two years; call it three. Rian was then sixteen." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "That" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "would make Rian about five when Bill became ambassador, eleven years\nearlier." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "This theory keeps the best of the Cassie/Pavlatos connection without the\nextra complications of time-travel to get Rian's age right. I think it's\ngood as far as it goes (I still want the Cassie/Margaret connection)." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Whereas I was trying to avoid any Cassie/Margaret connection, for reasons\npreviously given. If Pavlatos is a future Cassie, she would be just\nabout midway in age between Cassie and Margaret. If Margaret is also a\nfuture Cassie, she would have the memories of Pavlatos, and her wealth. What\nhappened to the money? Reis supposedly checked out Margaret's past, and so\nwould the FBI after the kidnapping. It's hard to believe that she could have\nfaked it convincingly.\n\nIt bothers me that Margaret was on the street near the bank when Cassie got\nback to Kingsport, and Cassie says she knows Margaret didn't recognize her.\nWhy not? Why was Margaret even there? Without the diamonds, there would be\nno money to buy the hopper to get to Woldercan and the past. Any future\nCassie would have the same retina scans that gave access to the diamonds.\n\nOkay, Cassie/Margaret was an actress, so she could have faked the lack of\nrecognition. But why be there at all? If she had been both Pavlatos and\nCassie, she knew that she had failed twice to thwart Bill's death and\nCassie's ordeal. And, if she had been Cassie/Pavlatos, then she had gotten\nBill back, after a fashion, and nothing is forever." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Does Pavlatos alone account for the reality-warping around Cassie\n(addresses, changes in what she remembers)? Or are there more\ntime-travelers to worry about? Bill's travels in time are pretty well\nestablished (he couldn't have put together a play to trap her without\nmore time)." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I agree that Bill needed more time than seems possible to have put together\nthe play that is centered on Cassie. He had to have known about her long\nbefore the day he went to the cast party. Though indirect, this may be the\nbest indicator of time travel in the story. So why give her the radioactive\ngold? One answer is that he didn't. That is, this leads back to previous\ntheories of more than one version of him operating at the same time, the\nWally vs. Bill bit and the seemingly pointless point of whether or not he\nwas in the audience and what color dress she was wearing when he first saw\nher.\n\nBut this opens up another can of worms. If Bill is a time traveler, then he\nprobably knows he will die on that island. In fact, it seems that he does\nknow the circumstances of his death -- he gave a rather accurate\nforeshadowing of exactly what Cassie would see happen at her feet. He told\nher the night he gave her the diamonds (145-46). This gets hairy. If he is\ntrying to change the past, so they can be happy together, he probably had no\nbetter luck than Cassie. And how did he get back to the past if he was dead?\nCassie must be the answer. She went to Woldercan and into the past to find a\nliving version of him. That version wrote the play.\n\nAnd the mention of clones is a red herring." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Is reality warping to keep things on track, the \"If I don't\nsend mine, his will have to be accounted for in some other way and it's\nliable to get complicated\" of a universe that fights back against\nparadoxes?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "That may be all there is to it. Both Cassie and Bill try to change things\nfor the better, but they find themselves stuck in an immutable time loop.\nThat is, the big things can't be changed, just some minor details that don't\naffect the big picture.\n\n-Roy" } ] }, { "message_id": "<4AC36470.9000904@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Dave Tallman", "address": "davetallman at msn.com" }, "date": "2009-09-30T14:00:16+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": "<001901ca4137$b3e1b200$2dce4a0c@rclackey>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Roy C. Lackey wrote:\nWhereas I was trying to avoid any Cassie/Margaret connection, for reasons\npreviously given. If Pavlatos is a future Cassie, she would be just\nabout midway in age between Cassie and Margaret. If Margaret is also a\nfuture Cassie, she would have the memories of Pavlatos, and her wealth. What\nhappened to the money? Reis supposedly checked out Margaret's past, and so\nwould the FBI after the kidnapping. It's hard to believe that she could have\nfaked it convincingly.\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Going back that far into the past probably required a long hopper trip, \nand fuel rods are expensive. She also may not have taken much wealth \nback with her." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "It bothers me that Margaret was on the street near the bank when Cassie got\nback to Kingsport, and Cassie says she knows Margaret didn't recognize her.\nWhy not? Why was Margaret even there? Without the diamonds, there would be\nno money to buy the hopper to get to Woldercan and the past. Any future\nCassie would have the same retina scans that gave access to the diamonds.\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Was it coincidence that Cassie ran into Margaret in the large city, or \ndid Margaret know she would be there? Margaret may have wanted to see \nher younger self one more time. Margaret had no reason to clear out the \ndiamonds before Cassie can get them. She wanted Cassie to have her \nexperiences. I'm reminded of Margaret easily locating the bracelet in \nthe hotel safe and knowing the combination when Cassie had forgotten she \neven used the safe. Perhaps she didn't forget -- it was Margaret who put \nthem away for her. If so, Margaret could have taken them that night, and \nshe refrained." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Okay, Cassie/Margaret was an actress, so she could have faked the lack of\nrecognition. But why be there at all? If she had been both Pavlatos and\nCassie, she knew that she had failed twice to thwart Bill's death and\nCassie's ordeal. And, if she had been Cassie/Pavlatos, then she had gotten\nBill back, after a fashion, and nothing is forever.\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "At the end, Maraget knows she's powerless to change the past except in \nminor ways. It might be she wanted to see her younger self one more time \nout of nostalgia. She didn't attempt to change anything -- she just \nlooked and pretended not to recognize her." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I agree that Bill needed more time than seems possible to have put together\nthe play that is centered on Cassie. He had to have known about her long\nbefore the day he went to the cast party. Though indirect, this may be the\nbest indicator of time travel in the story. So why give her the radioactive\ngold? One answer is that he didn't. That is, this leads back to previous\ntheories of more than one version of him operating at the same time, the\nWally vs. Bill bit and the seemingly pointless point of whether or not he\nwas in the audience and what color dress she was wearing when he first saw\nher.\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "The play seems to have been written with an evil motive toward Cassie. \nThe very title suggests a woman who will be sacrificed, thrown into a \nvolcano. Call this state of mind Killer Bill. I think it was Killer Bill \nwho went back into the past as soon as he heard that Chase would be \nusing Cassie. He wanted to buy himself some time to destroy her. From \nChase's point of view, Killer Bill would have acted with frightening \nspeed. perhaps frightening enough for Chase to join Bill's camp (p. 125).\n\nKiller Bill had the bracelet made and worked with someone to write the \nplay. He met with India and got tickets, but he didn't go see Cassie \nperform that night. After the play, he bribed Jimmy to take a gift to \nCassie (the radioactive bracelet). If that had worked, he would have \nbeen able to plant the deadly gold on her with less of a back-trail to \nhimself. Jimmy failed, so Killer Bill eliminated him as a witness.\n\nHe went to the party in person and gave Cassie the bracelet in a way she \ncouldn't easily refuse. But now he had seen her face-to-face, and her \nstar-power began to work on him. He soon began to regret his plans. He \ndoubled back in time and watched the performance. Now he was really \nhooked, and went from Killer Bill to Wooing Wally. He got the bracelet \nback and asked Cassie out. When he said he first saw her in green, he \nwas telling the truth. The party, not the play, was where he first saw her.\n\nNone of this time-travel gives Bill any foreknowledge of his death. His \ndescription of an execution scene to Cassie was accurate (this is how \nthey executed people on the island, with the \"permission\" of the Queen), \nbut I don't think he knew at the time it would be applied to himself. \nThis is just dramatic irony." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "James Wynn", "address": "crushtv at gmail.com" }, "date": "2009-09-30T15:01:35+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": "<001901ca4137$b3e1b200$2dce4a0c@rclackey>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I do like the explanation of time-travel for Pavlatos-as-Cassie--because of \nthe her opportune rescue and no other reason. However, Time travel does not \nexplain why one of the Bill Rieses tried to kill Cassie with a poison \nbracelet.\n\nWell, not exactly. It is just that it is difficult to combine that with \nCassie having gone back in Time to marry Riese. You could say \"Riese knew \nthat his marriage to Cassie would lead to his death.\" But where does a Reise \nthat wants to do that and knows about the upcoming marriage fit in to the \nTime-line?\n\nAnyway, the marriage does not *cause* Riese's death. It was caused by his \nplan to set the US and the Island (refugee) Aliens against each other. So \nwhy not stop that? I still think the idea of a Woldercon imposters (maybe \nthree of them) stands a good chance of fitting in here somewhere.\n\nJ.\n " } ] }, { "message_id": "<003501ca425b$56d5f4c0$c8ce4a0c@rclackey>", "from": { "name": "Roy C. Lackey", "address": "rclackey at stic.net" }, "date": "2009-10-01T05:52:13+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": "<4AC36470.9000904@gmail.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Dave Tallman wrote:\n\n[snip]" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I'm reminded of Margaret easily locating the bracelet in\nthe hotel safe and knowing the combination when Cassie had forgotten she\neven used the safe. Perhaps she didn't forget -- it was Margaret who put\nthem away for her. If so, Margaret could have taken them that night, and\nshe refrained." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "There is an odd bit of dialogue in the breakfast scene the next morning,\np-153, Margaret speaking first:\n________________\n\"You ought to get a thing at the bank, Miss Casey. A safety deposit.\"\n\"I will, only back home. Not here.\"\n\"That fits perfectly.\" Zelda nodded to herself. \"Thank you, Margaret.\"\n\"Fits what?\"\n\"In a minute. Here's the waitress, and you haven't even looked.\"\n__________________\n\nWhat was Zelda alluding to? She never brought it up again.\n\n[snip]" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "None of this time-travel gives Bill any foreknowledge of his death. His\ndescription of an execution scene to Cassie was accurate (this is how\nthey executed people on the island, with the \"permission\" of the Queen),\nbut I don't think he knew at the time it would be applied to himself.\nThis is just dramatic irony." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I think he did know that some version of him would die that death. The \"seat\nof justice\" where Cassie sat while Bill was killed was used by the \"high\nking or high queen\" to \"announce to our assembled nation the justice of the\nSky Gods\" (282). So I don't think garden-variety executions were performed\nthere.\n\nJames Wynn wrote:\n[snip]" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I still think the idea of a Woldercon imposters (maybe\nthree of them) stands a good chance of fitting in here somewhere." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I would like for that to work, too. But the text doesn't give me enough to\nprove it, or even make a good case. I don't like to have to resort to messy\ntime travel to unravel the plot of AEG, but we may be stuck with it.\n\n-Roy" } ] }, { "message_id": "<4AC44FC5.60806@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Dave Tallman", "address": "davetallman at msn.com" }, "date": "2009-10-01T06:44:21+00:00", "subject": "(urth) AEG: Bill's wives", "in_reply_to": "<003501ca425b$56d5f4c0$c8ce4a0c@rclackey>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Roy C. Lackey wrote:\nThere is an odd bit of dialogue in the breakfast scene the next morning,\np-153, Margaret speaking first:\n________________\n\"You ought to get a thing at the bank, Miss Casey. A safety deposit.\"\n\"I will, only back home. Not here.\"\n\"That fits perfectly.\" Zelda nodded to herself. \"Thank you, Margaret.\"\n\"Fits what?\"\n\"In a minute. Here's the waitress, and you haven't even looked.\"\n__________________\n\nWhat was Zelda alluding to? She never brought it up again.\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Zelda owns a hopper. Could she also be some sort of time-traveler? It \nwill fit Casey's need perfectly to have some valuables deposited that \nshe can access in the future even after her mojo loss. Either that or \nZelda is composing a haiku. \"Safety deposit\" has five syllables." } ] }, { "message_id": "<89F20C5F3E7F46D79A42E9F7C76A401B@eMachinePC>", "from": { "name": "James Wynn", "address": "crushtv at gmail.com" }, "date": "2009-10-01T18:12:07+00:00", "subject": "(urth) time-travel, clones, and changlings", "in_reply_to": "<003501ca425b$56d5f4c0$c8ce4a0c@rclackey>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I would like for [the idea of a Woldercon imposters] to work, too.\nBut the text doesn't give me enough to\nprove it, or even make a good case. I don't like to have to resort to \nmessy\ntime travel to unravel the plot of AEG, but we may be stuck with it." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Well, I want there to be an element of time-travel, because I want the time \ndifferential between Earth and Woldercan to factor in. But, realistically, \nthere is *barely* more discussion of that than there is of cloning.\n\nOn the other hand, there is the hard and fast presence of Fairyland in AEG \n(banshees, gray neighbors, little voices in Chase's car) and associations of \nWoldercon with it. Fairyland also operates on a shifted clock from the \nmortal world. Time moves more slowly there (as with Aelfrice) and sometimes \nfaster, which again could wreak havoc with time-lines.\n\nFor those steeped in fairy lore (and Wolfe seems to be), the concept of \nfairies switching places with mortals is practically fundamental (eg the \nMabinogion and stories of \"changlings\"). David Lebling declared as early as \nSeptember of last year that Chase was surely a Woldercanese. He didn't seem \nto consider it debatable, and let's face it, the text refers to him as \"a \nguest\" in the first page. Ries is said to have been corrupted by his search \nfor power. But Chase seems willing to be employed by **anyone to do \nanything** for money (gold). Like Phaedra, Sherry Gold, and Hyacinth, he's \nthe consummate prostitute. He's surely the evil guest of the title (or one \nof them...it's hard to get around Wolfe's identification of Ries as a \nvillain). Also, the text declares that Chase is known by other identities on \nthe first page as well.\n\nSecondly, I'm coming across analogies to \"mirrors\" and copies. Chase makes \ncopies of photographs of Ries and then tears up the originals. Chase enters \nCassie's apartment through an adjacent apartment that \"mirrors\" her own. \nAnd, then of course in the movie version of \"Dr. Lao\", the residents are \nduplicated in Woldercon. Granted, this could be explained by clones, but it \nis hard to wedge Chase in as a clone. He's a figure of fairyland...a wizard \n(IIRC in the old story of the child Merlin confronting Vortigern, Merlin is \nhalf demon).\n\nEven Pavlatos's coincidental appearance at the island could be explained by \n1) her association with Chase who would know where the Bat People would take \nCassie if things went to hell\n2) her being a Cassie-changeling and thus knowing where the Bat People took \nCassie.\nIn fact, Chase might be the sole reason they are stalking her. After all, \nhe's in the employ of both the government and Ries, so what are the chances \nhe is not hand-in-glove with these weird alien-fairies?)\n\nWhat I'm saying is, that there is IMO at least as much textual opening to \nchangelings as there is to time-travel or clones. And (I admit I'm looking \nin the street instead of the alley since there's more light there) it does \nnot open the narrative to infinite speculative theories (merely an \nuncomfortably large number) of unmentioned trips back-and-forth to get to \nthe \"right\" number of iterations (three) despite the US government being \nmysteriously unaware of the potential.\n\nI'm increasingly troubled by the degree to which AEG/The Tree Is My Hat are \nnovels set within an extensive lightly-referenced and expurgated super-plot. \nThis is was a significant problem regarding Typhon and Blue's Neighbors, but \nit is exponentially frustrating in this new world.\n\nJ. " } ] }, { "message_id": "<4AC57C32.7060400@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "Dave Tallman", "address": "davetallman at msn.com" }, "date": "2009-10-02T04:06:10+00:00", "subject": "(urth) time-travel, clones, and changlings", "in_reply_to": "<89F20C5F3E7F46D79A42E9F7C76A401B@eMachinePC>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "James Wynn writes:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "In fact, Chase might be the sole reason they are stalking her. After all, \nhe's in the employ of both the government and Ries, so what are the chances \nhe is not hand-in-glove with these weird alien-fairies?)\n " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Yes, I think it's well-established that the bat-people work with and/or \nfor Chase.\n1) One is present at Cassie's transformation. (p. 43, \"Behind him: \ngreat, dark wings.\")\n2) One flies along with the hopper that contains Corby. (p. 156, \n\"...something that might have been a monstrous bat.\")\n3) He warns her not to go outside late at night on p. 171. \"...some \nthings else. I don't want you to see them... Don't leave your windows open.\"\n4) Reis tells her, (p. 191), \"I'm trying to make them mine, if you want \nto put it that way. I'd like to, and I will.\" This directly parallels \nhis efforts to get Chase to work for him. It seems to imply that if he \ngets Chase, he will get the bat-things.\n5) There's the whole Batman/Robin thing going on between Chase and \nCassie, especially the part about wanting to drive the \"Batmobile.\" \nChase is a dark detective like Batman. Cassie is the bat's \"cub\" (p. 235)." } ] } ] }