{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/559", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 559, "subject": "End of Book One", "messages": 4, "voices": 4, "first": "1998-05-05T09:25:18+00:00", "last": "1998-05-06T08:52:49+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Tony Ellis", "address": "tony.ellis at futurenet.co.uk" }, "date": "1998-05-05T09:25:18+00:00", "subject": "(urth) End of Book One", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " \n05/05/98\n 10:15\n End of Book One" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "FunkMonkey wrote:\nAs a side note: I read the archives and someone wondered what the\ndisturbance was at the gate of Nessus toward the end of book one. I don't\nthink its a coincidence that the chapter is named Hethor and he makes his\nfirst appearence. My theory is that he has loosed some sort of creature\nthat is causing quite a commotion." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "No monsters. The disturbance is caused by five armed soldiers on\ndestriers. The soldiers are there because it is illegal to travel on the\ncommonwealth's roads." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "J. Schultz", "address": "jschultz at wcnet.org" }, "date": "1998-05-05T17:55:45+00:00", "subject": "(urth) RE:End of Book One", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I don't agree.\nWhile I agree that the solidiers are present by Severian's dream account.\nThey do not apear to attacking anyone or anything. They are mearly standing\nat the head of the road and keeping people from using it. The disturbance\nIN the wall has created a panic and people are pouring out of the gate in\nfear, being pressed against the wall of soldiers, and thus being scattered.\nMuch like the bouncers at a general admission concert, the soldiers are\nforming a wall which is holding back a sea of frenzied humanity. \"On these\nriders, the tide of travelers broke as a wave on rock, some turning left,\nsome right.\"\n\nHowever, I do think their may be another hint as to what happened at the\nwall.\nFunkMonkey Theory Two:\n\nDr. Talos on the creatures inside the wall: \"I do not doubt that there are\namong them many who search fo some particular miscreant, and that if they\nwere to see the one they seek, they would sally out and lay hold of him.\"\nHethor, as noted by Sev., is hanging his head. Sev. thinks its due to the\nopression of the great wall's enormity and weight felt when passing through\nit. Sev's been wrong before, esp about people's motives.\nCould it be that Hethor is wanted for some crime? The creatures in the\nwall, while it's mentioned that they are engineered humans, some could\ndefinitly be cacogens. Hethor, afraid of being recognized is hanging his\nhead. Some sort of interstellar outlaw. The creatures in the wall see him\nand \"sally out\" to \"lay hold of him.\" Obviously they don't get him as he\nshows up in Saltus.\n\nWhat would Hethor's crime be? WARNING:Quantum leap in logic... He hints at\nthe fact that he may of been the CAPTAIN of the -quazar-. \"I the old\ncaptain, the old lieutenant, the old c-c-cook in his old kitchen, cooking\nsoup, cooking broth for the dying pets!\" he has obviously been unbalanced\nby the crew stealing his 'doll.' He claims death (Sev) is his master and\nuses the afformentioned line as justification. Could it be that after\nfinding his living doll missing (Maybe it showed up with the phantom cat in\nanother story) Hethor, captain of the -quazar- poisons his crew and kills\nthem all (cooking soup for the dying pets). Steals some mirrors, jumps ship\nand lives out his days as a fugitive. Cacogen's and the Autarch brand him a\ncriminal and are on the look out for him.\n\nJust another leap in logic that I'm good for. Food for discussion.\nFunkMonkey" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "William H. Ansley", "address": "wansley at warwick.net" }, "date": "1998-05-06T00:15:56+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) RE:End of Book One", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "FunkMonkey Theory Two:\n\nDr. Talos on the creatures inside the wall: \"I do not doubt that there are\namong them many who search fo some particular miscreant, and that if they\nwere to see the one they seek, they would sally out and lay hold of him.\"\nHethor, as noted by Sev., is hanging his head. Sev. thinks its due to the\nopression of the great wall's enormity and weight felt when passing through\nit. Sev's been wrong before, esp about people's motives.\nCould it be that Hethor is wanted for some crime?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I *like* this theory! It seems to explain everything quite well, except why\nno one mentions the cacogens coming out of the wall later on. (Maybe the\ncacogens had those little MIB flashbulb amnesia tubes!) I can certainly\nbelieve that Hethor was a wanted man." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "The creatures in the\nwall, while it's mentioned that they are engineered humans, some could\ndefinitly be cacogens. Hethor, afraid of being recognized is hanging his\nhead. Some sort of interstellar outlaw. The creatures in the wall see him\nand \"sally out\" to \"lay hold of him.\" Obviously they don't get him as he\nshows up in Saltus." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Severian does say this when talking about the wall: \"Cacogens, I think,\nwere there, beings to whom the avern was but what a marigold or marguerite\nis to us.\"\n(very near the end of _Shadow_, p. 208 of the Orb ed. While this isn't a\nguarantee, it certainly makes cacogens in the wall a possibility." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "What would Hethor's crime be? WARNING:Quantum leap in logic... He hints at\nthe fact that he may of been the CAPTAIN of the -quazar-. \"I the old\ncaptain, the old lieutenant, the old c-c-cook in his old kitchen, cooking\nsoup, cooking broth for the dying pets!\" he has obviously been unbalanced\nby the crew stealing his 'doll.' He claims death (Sev) is his master and\nuses the afformentioned line as justification. Could it be that after\nfinding his living doll missing (Maybe it showed up with the phantom cat in\nanother story) Hethor, captain of the -quazar- poisons his crew and kills\nthem all (cooking soup for the dying pets). Steals some mirrors, jumps ship\nand lives out his days as a fugitive. Cacogen's and the Autarch brand him a\ncriminal and are on the look out for him." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "While I wouldn't rule out that Hethor killed off everyone else on the\nQuasar, I always took that \"cooking soup for the dying pets\" line to mean\nthat he was trying to keep some of his alien creatures alive, since he\ndidn't know what to feed them and they were starving.\n\nWilliam Ansley" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Peter Stephenson", "address": "pws at ifh.de" }, "date": "1998-05-06T08:52:49+00:00", "subject": "Re: (urth) RE:End of Book One", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "What would Hethor's crime be? WARNING:Quantum leap in logic... He hints at\nthe fact that he may of been the CAPTAIN of the -quazar-. \"I the old\ncaptain, the old lieutenant, the old c-c-cook in his old kitchen, cooking\nsoup, cooking broth for the dying pets!\" he has obviously been unbalanced\nby the crew stealing his 'doll.'" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Ever on the look out for tenuous links: there's a late nineteenth century\nhumorous poem by W.S. Gilbert, about an old sailor the narrator met,\nwandering around the coast. It turns out he's the last survivor of a\nshipwreck, and has actually eaten his way through the rest of the crew to\nsurvive --- the last person he ate being the cook, if I remember right;\nthere's a debate at some point about who is competent to cook whom.\n\nAnyway, what triggered the association with the quotation above was the\nverse, repeated several times as the reader gradually works out what has\nhappened, which I quote from ancient memory:\n\n`Oh, I am the cook, and the captain bold,\nAnd the mate of the Nancy Brig,\nAnd the bosun tight, and the midshipmite,\nAnd the crew of the captain's gig.'\n\nIs it _just_ possible that Hethor has eaten his shipmates to survive,\nand that is his crime???\n\nThe poem is called `The Yarn[?] of the Nancy Bell', and although I can't\npoint to a copy it's in lots of anthologies, particularly for children.\n\npws" }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Peter Stephenson Tel: +39 50 844536\nWWW: http://www.ifh.de/~pws/\nGruppo Teorico, Dipartimento di Fisica\nPiazza Torricelli 2, 56100 Pisa, Italy" } ] } ] }