Hyacinth and Seawrack

I've been reading Return to the Whorl and had a question. I think it is for James Wynn. Wasn't it you who suggested some sort of connection or shared identity between Hyacinth and Seawrack? I tried looking/searching but couldn't find the post.

I thought of it because I ran across a section where Horn is describing to Vadsig how he and Maytera Mint and Patera Silk and Seawrack overthrew the Ayuntamiento. If the inclusion of Seawrack was an auctorial error (...)

Lee Berman- I've been reading Return to the Whorl and had a question. I think it is for James Wynn. Wasn't it you who suggested some sort of connection or shared identity between Hyacinth and Seawrack? I tried looking/searching but couldn't find the post. I thought of it because I ran across a section where Horn is describing to Vadsig how he and Maytera Mint and Patera Silk and Seawrack overthrew the Ayuntamiento. If the inclusion of Seawrack was an auctorial error I'd find that pretty interesting, as I am more interested than most in the autobiographical aspects of Gene Wolfe's work. More likely it is an example of unreliable narrator error I suppose. As such my first interpretation would be that the error occurs due to relationship parallels. Horn's paramour is Seawrack. Pas/Typhon's paramour is Kypris. Silk and Hyacinth, possessing aspects of the gods, provide the bridge between these two pairs, thus Seawrack and Hyacinth are confused. Am I missing some some real world (within the story) way that Seawrack and Hyacinth can be connected in the way that Silk and Horn are connected?

Lee Berman- Am I missing some some real world (within the story) way that Seawrack and Hyacinth can be connected in the way that Silk and Horn are connected? I'm pretty sure that is not the only time the Rajan confuses Hy with Seawrack. I couldn't tell you exactly where. I thought there was a time where he talks about Hyacinth singing.

Antonio P. Marques: Hyacinth is the woman Silk ever found more attractive, and Seawrack is the woman Horn ever found more attractive. It's only natural that the Silk in Horn would sometimes make the latter mix up the names of the two.

Dave Tallman quoted and wrote: James Wynn wrote: I'm pretty sure that is not the only time the Rajan confuses Hy with Seawrack. I couldn't tell you exactly where. I thought there was a time where he talks about Hyacinth singing. There is, in IGJ, p. 121. "Here I stopped to listen, for I heard Hyacinth singing to her waves." I believe this is more about the Narrator's identity confusion than any real identification of Hyacinth with Seawrack. He exchanges one love for another because he is really two men. A similar mistake is when he addresses one of his sons as "Horn" in the last book.

Dave Tallman- I believe this is more about the Narrator's identity confusion than any real identification of Hyacinth with Seawrack. He exchanges one love for another because he is really two men. A similar mistake is when he addresses one of his sons as "Horn" in the last book.

I agree. IIRC, there are also other places where Silkhorn confuses one wife with the other, when he writes Hyacinth when he means Nettle. He also consciously substitutes Hyacinth's name for Nettle's at least once, when he spoke to Chandi: "As for me, I did not weep; but I was at least as homesick as she, and when she was calmer I told her about you, Nettle, calling you Hyacinth." (OBW, 222) He also mentions Seawrack's singing on the same page.

James Wynn wrote: Hmmm... perhaps. But the fact that he is aware, in this event at least, that he is making these transpositions gives me pause. In the case of Chandi, I think he makes a deliberate choice. He knows she thinks he's Silk, and she probably knows Silk's wife's name is Hyacinth. So to avoid confusion and mistrust, he chooses to speak of Nettle this way.