{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/6120", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 6120, "subject": "Personal attacks", "messages": 8, "voices": 5, "first": "2011-11-22T15:09:57+00:00", "last": "2011-11-22T17:26:51+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "<304281.93699.qm@smtp818.mail.ird.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "Mo Holkar", "address": "lists at ukg.co.uk" }, "date": "2011-11-22T15:09:57+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Hi all,\n\nGuys, some of you are currently making this list a really annoying \nplace to hang out -- to the extent that I'm just deleting threads unread.\n\nIt always seems to be observations about one another's distasteful \nmodes of discourse that gets us to this point. I would really like \nthat to be a banned topic, as it seems never to be helpful or \ninformative, but invariably produces a trail of vitriol.\n\nCould you please just lay off each other?\n\nbest wishes,\n\nMo\n\n\n# ~ # ~ #\n\nWolfeWiki -- a wiki about Gene Wolfe\nhttp://www.wolfewiki.com/pmwiki/ " } ] }, { "message_id": "<2699B7C0-0600-4B4F-9CD0-56C41D3F294E@liftingfaces.com>", "from": { "name": "Ryan Dunn", "address": "ryan at liftingfaces.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T15:47:57+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "<304281.93699.qm@smtp818.mail.ird.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I have literally deleted over 100 emails entitled Babbiecorn... for this very reason, Mo.\n\nThere is a thin but important line between passionate discourse and slanderous rhetoric, which is getting quite blurry of late.\n\nThanks you for raising the concern.\n\n...ryan" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Nov 22, 2011, at 10:09 AM, Mo Holkar wrote:\nHi all,\n\nGuys, some of you are currently making this list a really annoying place to hang out -- to the extent that I'm just deleting threads unread.\n\nIt always seems to be observations about one another's distasteful modes of discourse that gets us to this point. I would really like that to be a banned topic, as it seems never to be helpful or informative, but invariably produces a trail of vitriol.\n\nCould you please just lay off each other?\n\nbest wishes,\n\nMo\n\n\n# ~ # ~ #\n\nWolfeWiki -- a wiki about Gene Wolfe\nhttp://www.wolfewiki.com/pmwiki/ \n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Daniel Petersen", "address": "danielottojackpetersen at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T15:59:52+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "<2699B7C0-0600-4B4F-9CD0-56C41D3F294E@liftingfaces.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "*chimes in with similar sentiment to the others raising concerns*\n\n-DOJP" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 3:47 PM, Ryan Dunn wrote:\nI have literally deleted over 100 emails entitled Babbiecorn... for this\nvery reason, Mo.\n\nThere is a thin but important line between passionate discourse and\nslanderous rhetoric, which is getting quite blurry of late.\n\nThanks you for raising the concern.\n\n...ryan\n\nOn Nov 22, 2011, at 10:09 AM, Mo Holkar wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Hi all,\n\nGuys, some of you are currently making this list a really annoying place\nto hang out -- to the extent that I'm just deleting threads unread.\n\nIt always seems to be observations about one another's distasteful modes\nof discourse that gets us to this point. I would really like that to be a\nbanned topic, as it seems never to be helpful or informative, but\ninvariably produces a trail of vitriol.\n\nCould you please just lay off each other?\n\nbest wishes,\n\nMo\n\n\n# ~ # ~ #\n\nWolfeWiki -- a wiki about Gene Wolfe\nhttp://www.wolfewiki.com/pmwiki/\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<4ECBC7B3.4040208@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "António Pedro Marques", "address": "entonio at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T16:02:59+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "<2699B7C0-0600-4B4F-9CD0-56C41D3F294E@liftingfaces.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Ryan Dunn wrote (22-11-2011 15:47):" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I have literally deleted over 100 emails entitled Babbiecorn... for this\nvery reason, Mo.\n\nThere is a thin but important line between passionate discourse and\nslanderous rhetoric, which is getting quite blurry of late.\n\nThanks you for raising the concern." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I think it's quite clear when one goes from criticism of the other's ideas \nto criticism of the other's intelligence/education/motivations/persona. And \nI think whenever that line is crossed, moderation would be in order.\n\nYou may have lost one or two interesting points by deleting the recent \nthreads, but I don't think you need to worry." } ] }, { "message_id": "<1321979739.93975.YahooMailClassic@web161806.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "Marc Aramini", "address": "marcaramini at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T16:35:39+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "<4ECBC7B3.4040208@gmail.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "--- On Tue, 11/22/11, Ant?nio Pedro Marques wrote:\nFrom: Ant?nio Pedro Marques \nSubject: Re: (urth) Personal attacks\nTo: \"The Urth Mailing List\" \nDate: Tuesday, November 22, 2011, 8:02 AM\nRyan Dunn wrote (22-11-2011 15:47):" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "I have literally deleted over 100 emails entitled\nBabbiecorn... for this\nvery reason, Mo.\n\nThere is a thin but important line between passionate\ndiscourse and\nslanderous rhetoric, which is getting quite blurry of\nlate.\n\nThanks you for raising the concern." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I think it's quite clear when one goes from criticism of\nthe other's ideas to criticism of the other's\nintelligence/education/motivations/persona. And I think\nwhenever that line is crossed, moderation would be in\norder.\n\nYou may have lost one or two interesting points by deleting\nthe recent threads, but I don't think you need to worry.\n_______________________________________________" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I really don't try to make anything personal, if I am guilty I apologize. It is unfortunate though, the topics I care about tend to generate into these \"deleted unread\" categories for most :( I started the Hunter in the East/Fitzgerald one and then just stood back as the stones flew. Sorry." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Daniel Petersen", "address": "danielottojackpetersen at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T16:40:52+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "<1321979739.93975.YahooMailClassic@web161806.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Wow, thanks for the admirable willingness to publicly apologise for any\npart you may have had in it, Marc.\n\nOn a different but related note, is there a Wolfe scholar out there who\ncould make a digest of the main outlines of the main arguments on\nthis mega-behemoth of a list?\n\n-DOJP" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 4:35 PM, Marc Aramini wrote:\n\n\n--- On Tue, 11/22/11, Ant?nio Pedro Marques wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "From: Ant?nio Pedro Marques \nSubject: Re: (urth) Personal attacks\nTo: \"The Urth Mailing List\" \nDate: Tuesday, November 22, 2011, 8:02 AM\nRyan Dunn wrote (22-11-2011 15:47):" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "I have literally deleted over 100 emails entitled\nBabbiecorn... for this\nvery reason, Mo.\n\nThere is a thin but important line between passionate\ndiscourse and\nslanderous rhetoric, which is getting quite blurry of\nlate.\n\nThanks you for raising the concern." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "I think it's quite clear when one goes from criticism of\nthe other's ideas to criticism of the other's\nintelligence/education/motivations/persona. And I think\nwhenever that line is crossed, moderation would be in\norder.\n\nYou may have lost one or two interesting points by deleting\nthe recent threads, but I don't think you need to worry.\n_______________________________________________" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I really don't try to make anything personal, if I am guilty I apologize.\n It is unfortunate though, the topics I care about tend to generate into\nthese \"deleted unread\" categories for most :( I started the Hunter in the\nEast/Fitzgerald one and then just stood back as the stones flew. Sorry.\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<4ECBD1AE.7040201@gmail.com>", "from": { "name": "António Pedro Marques", "address": "entonio at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T16:45:34+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "<1321979739.93975.YahooMailClassic@web161806.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I don't think you have to apologise to anyone, Marc, I've never seen you \nwrite even a hint of a personal attack.\n\nIt's true that some topics are livelier than others, but I don't think \nliveliness is the problem." } ] }, { "message_id": "<144B6893-DC55-4D74-B73A-8553A1DB5A68@liftingfaces.com>", "from": { "name": "Ryan Dunn", "address": "ryan at liftingfaces.com" }, "date": "2011-11-22T17:26:51+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Personal attacks", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "My suspicion is that America may have a balanced budget before there is a streamlined Urth compendium.\n\nI think the trusty old search-for-keyword, followed by minutes-and-minutes of wheat and chaff separation is here to stay.\n\n...ryan" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Nov 22, 2011, at 11:40 AM, Daniel Petersen wrote:\nWow, thanks for the admirable willingness to publicly apologise for any part you may have had in it, Marc. \n \nOn a different but related note, is there a Wolfe scholar out there who could make a digest of the main outlines of the main arguments on this mega-behemoth of a list?\n \n-DOJP\n\nOn Tue, Nov 22, 2011 at 4:35 PM, Marc Aramini wrote:\n\n\n--- On Tue, 11/22/11, Ant?nio Pedro Marques wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "From: Ant?nio Pedro Marques \nSubject: Re: (urth) Personal attacks\nTo: \"The Urth Mailing List\" \nDate: Tuesday, November 22, 2011, 8:02 AM\nRyan Dunn wrote (22-11-2011 15:47):" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "I have literally deleted over 100 emails entitled\nBabbiecorn... for this\nvery reason, Mo.\n\nThere is a thin but important line between passionate\ndiscourse and\nslanderous rhetoric, which is getting quite blurry of\nlate.\n\nThanks you for raising the concern." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "I think it's quite clear when one goes from criticism of\nthe other's ideas to criticism of the other's\nintelligence/education/motivations/persona. And I think\nwhenever that line is crossed, moderation would be in\norder.\n\nYou may have lost one or two interesting points by deleting\nthe recent threads, but I don't think you need to worry.\n_______________________________________________" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I really don't try to make anything personal, if I am guilty I apologize. It is unfortunate though, the topics I care about tend to generate into these \"deleted unread\" categories for most :( I started the Hunter in the East/Fitzgerald one and then just stood back as the stones flew. Sorry.\n_______________________________________________" } ] } ] }