{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/6133", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 6133, "subject": "two Siyufs?", "messages": 11, "voices": 5, "first": "2011-12-05T18:59:13+00:00", "last": "2011-12-07T13:09:23+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Larry Miller", "address": "decanus1284 at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-05T18:59:13+00:00", "subject": "(urth) two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Im nearing the end of Exodus and wondering if there are two Siyufs.\nIs one a chem body akin to the Ayuntamientos chem bodies?" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Lee Berman", "address": "severiansola at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T13:26:43+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Larry Miller: Im nearing the end of Exodus and wondering if there are two Siyufs.\nIs one a chem body akin to the Ayuntamientos chem bodies?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I remember wondering something like that. But I find the end of the Long Sun saga\nto be a slog to get through and haven't re-read it much. It will be more interesting\nwhen you move on to Short Sun. \t\t \t \t\t " } ] }, { "message_id": "<435C5097523543818B3343D6B98DC76E@Rover>", "from": { "name": "Gerry Quinn", "address": "gerry at bindweed.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T14:22:13+00:00", "subject": "(urth) two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "From: Larry Miller " }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Im nearing the end of Exodus and wondering if there are two Siyufs.\nIs one a chem body akin to the Ayuntamientos chem bodies?" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Yes. A bit too implausible I thought, but seemingly Potto had a copy made. Of course it could be that he has access to special purpose chem bodies. Does it say anywhere where the councillors? chem bodies came from?\n- Gerry Quinn" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Larry Miller", "address": "decanus1284 at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T16:35:15+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Yeah Long Sun feels like work at times. Dont know if I want to jump\nback into Short Sun seeing as I just reread it two months ago.\nStarted reading Soldier in the Mist but quickly realized that too was\nno easy read. Reading Long Sun and Soldier at the same time was too\nmuch Wolfe for my brain. What do you suggest reread Short Sun or\nstart the Latro books?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 12/6/11, Lee Berman wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Larry Miller: Im nearing the end of Exodus and wondering if there are two\nSiyufs.\nIs one a chem body akin to the Ayuntamientos chem bodies?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I remember wondering something like that. But I find the end of the Long Sun\nsaga\nto be a slog to get through and haven't re-read it much. It will be more\ninteresting\nwhen you move on to Short Sun. \t\t \t \t\t\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Larry Miller", "address": "decanus1284 at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T16:55:52+00:00", "subject": "(urth) two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "<435C5097523543818B3343D6B98DC76E@Rover>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Not that I recall Gerry. Do you have any ideas? Is it possible they\ncould have been built by those at the Talus factory or some black\nmechanics that they had bought off?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 12/6/11, Gerry Quinn wrote:\n\n\nFrom: Larry Miller" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Im nearing the end of Exodus and wondering if there are two Siyufs.\nIs one a chem body akin to the Ayuntamientos chem bodies?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Yes. A bit too implausible I thought, but seemingly Potto had a copy made.\nOf course it could be that he has access to special purpose chem bodies.\nDoes it say anywhere where the councillors? chem bodies came from?\n- Gerry Quinn" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "danldo at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T17:06:13+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Larry Miller wrote:\nYeah Long Sun feels like work at times. “Dont know if I want to jump\nback into Short Sun seeing as I just reread it two months ago.\nStarted reading Soldier in the Mist but quickly realized that too was\nno easy read. ?Reading Long Sun and Soldier at the same time was too\nmuch Wolfe for my brain. ?What do you suggest reread Short Sun or\nstart the Latro books”" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Either is good, but if you haven't read the Latro books go for that." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Lee Berman", "address": "severiansola at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T17:19:56+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "What do you suggest reread Short Sun or start the Latro books?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Either is good, but if you haven't read the Latro books go for that." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " \nI agree. For me, 5HoC represents the roots and the Sun Series the trunk \nof the tree of Wolfe's writing. But the Soldier series and Wizard Knight \nare major branches. The good thing about feeling frustrated about reading\nWolfe is that you know you will re-read one day and have time to catch what\nyou missed. Also, there is this online forum... \t\t \t \t\t " } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Larry Miller", "address": "decanus1284 at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T18:29:02+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I was thinking the Latro books too. Is Soldier of Sidon the last book\nin the series or will there be one more? Ive also put off reading the\nWizard Knight because of the \"Connecticut Yankee in King Arthurs\nCourt\" premise which seems too fantasy for my taste. I always thought\nit was geared toward younger readers (which isnt a bad thing). Is it\non the same level as Wolfes other work as far as depth and complexity?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 12/6/11, Lee Berman wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "What do you suggest reread Short Sun or start the Latro books?" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Either is good, but if you haven't read the Latro books go for that." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "I agree. For me, 5HoC represents the roots and the Sun Series the trunk\nof the tree of Wolfe's writing. But the Soldier series and Wizard Knight\nare major branches. The good thing about feeling frustrated about reading\nWolfe is that you know you will re-read one day and have time to catch what\nyou missed. Also, there is this online forum... \t\t \t \t\t\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "danldo at gmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-06T18:33:00+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Larry Miller wrote:\nI was thinking the Latro books too. “Is Soldier of Sidon the last book\nin the series or will there be one more”" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "We may only hope, but I doubt there will be any more. If the books had\nbeen more successful when the first two came out there would probably\nhave been several." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "?Ive also put off reading the\nWizard Knight because of the \"Connecticut Yankee in King Arthurs\nCourt\" premise which seems too fantasy for my taste. “I always thought\nit was geared toward younger readers (which isnt a bad thing). ?Is it\non the same level as Wolfes other work as far as depth and complexity”" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "It's pretty deep and complex, but spells things out a little more.\nThere are all the usual Lupine tricks -- lacunae, misdirection, etc.\n-- but on a level that can be handled by a YA reader.\n\nIt really isn't a \"Connecticut Yankee\" premise; it's taken much more\nseriously than that." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes" } ] }, { "message_id": "<1323233790.6618.YahooMailNeo@web114701.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "Jerry Friedman", "address": "jerry_friedman at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2011-12-07T04:56:30+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "From: Dan'l Danehy-Oakes \nTo: The Urth Mailing List " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "..." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "“Ive also put off reading the\n Wizard Knight because of the \"Connecticut Yankee in King Arthurs\n Court\" premise which seems too fantasy for my taste. ?I always thought\n it was geared toward younger readers (which isnt a bad thing). ?Is it\n on the same level as Wolfes other work as far as depth and complexity”" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "It's pretty deep and complex, but spells things out a little more.\nThere are all the usual Lupine tricks -- lacunae, misdirection, etc.\n-- but on a level that can be handled by a YA reader." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "An exceptional YA reader, I'd say. People who could have followed TWK in their mid teens are undoubtedly overrepresented here." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "It really isn't a \"Connecticut Yankee\" premise; it's taken \nmuch more seriously than that." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "In fact, I'd say it's the anti-Connecticut-Yankee. I don't remember any way in \nwhich Able's modern knowledge, skills, or values help him in the \nmedieval-ish world (but will be happy to be corrected). I imagine Wolfe was making that point \nintentionally.\n\nI've mentioned my problems with it before, and others here have said they don't\n like it because they don't like Able. On the plus side, Wolfe seems to\n have solved his problem with weird dialogue that one of the worst \nfeatures of the /Short Sun/ is. H'if yer see what Jerry means, bucky.\n\nOn the whole, I liked it. I don't know whether I liked it or the /Soldier/ books better.\n\nJerry Friedman" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Lee Berman", "address": "severiansola at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2011-12-07T13:09:23+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Two Siyufs?", "in_reply_to": "<1323233790.6618.YahooMailNeo@web114701.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Jerry Friedman: In fact, I'd say it's the anti-Connecticut-Yankee. \nI don't remember any way in which Able's modern knowledge, skills, \nor values help him in the medieval-ish world (but will be happy to be \ncorrected). I imagine Wolfe was making that point intentionally." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " \nI agree. Judging from interviews, this may be one of the major points\nWolfe hopes to convey with his work- that ancient peoples were just as\nintelligent and capable of understanding the world as we are. If we \nhave an advantage over them, it is not so much that we have advanced\ntechnology but that we have Christ.\n \t\t \t \t\t " } ] } ] }