{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/6315", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 6315, "subject": "(no subject)", "messages": 5, "voices": 5, "first": "2012-11-26T15:20:12+00:00", "last": "2012-11-27T20:35:41+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Lee Berman", "address": "severiansola at hotmail.com" }, "date": "2012-11-26T15:20:12+00:00", "subject": "(urth) (no subject)", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "nate jarvis: I've been wondering if the inhumi's secret isn't that, if once given\nconsent to drink from a human, they then require consent to drink from\na human. It's the only thing I've thought of thus far that seems to\noffer a practical threat to the inhumi if revealed " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "In the Nick Gevers interview, Wolfe is asked, in complex fashion, about the secret of the Inhumi. \nHere is Wolfe's answer:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "If human beings did not prey on one another, the inhumi could not prey on us. That's all. It isn't \ncomplicated, and I thought that everyone would get it. Maybe the thought of human beings not preying \non their own kind is just too foreign. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Wolfe's answer does not (to me) address nate's concern. Horn is clear that the secret of the Inhumi \nmust be something which, if revealed, would threaten their entire race. I'm not sure if Wolfe is being\ndeliberately unclear or whether he had forgotten this aspect of it with this answer.\n\nMy own answer tries (weakly) to springboard from Wolfe's answer. Those humans who prey on other humans\ngenerally rely on stealth and deception. Especially if we buy into Daniel Petersen's ideas regarding\nWolfe's libertarianism, humans who prey upon other humans are to be considered parasites. One way of\nbeing a parasite is to be a stowaway.\n\nApologies for rehashing a previous discussion but I think that's the inhumi secret which, if revealed,\nwould threaten their species. A parasitic species needs to be able to travel. Stuck in one place, they\nwould quickly deplete their hosts and be left without food. The secret is that inhumi cannot, as they\nclaim, fly through space. Given Wolfe's awareness of scientific detail, I don't think the impossibility\nof unassisted biological space travel is something that escapes his attention.\n\nSo, the inhumi are, by nature, a species which specializes in imitating a host and getting rides to other\n planets on their spacecraft. We see this practice in two of the best known inhumi, Quetzal and Krait. If \nthis secret was revealed, the awareness and precautions would end up restricting the Inhumi to Green and \nend their species existence or at least their ability to expand outward. \t\t \t \t\t " } ] }, { "message_id": "<1353944046.30660.YahooMailClassic@web160705.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "Marc Aramini", "address": "marcaramini at yahoo.com" }, "date": "2012-11-26T15:34:06+00:00", "subject": "(urth) (no subject)", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "the secret of the inhumi is that they are all that is left of humanity, a vestigial parasite that can no longer breed without a fresh infusion of human blood.\n\nFor all intents and purposes, they are humans, and their little mating ritual where they pretend to be man and woman is just ontogeny recapitulating philogeny.\n\n\n--- On Mon, 11/26/12, Lee Berman wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "From: Lee Berman \nSubject: (urth) (no subject)\nTo: \"urth at urth.net\" \nDate: Monday, November 26, 2012, 7:20 AM\nnate jarvis: I've been wondering if the inhumi's secret isn't that, if once given\nconsent to drink from a human, they then require consent to drink from\na human. It's the only thing I've thought of thus far that seems to\noffer a practical threat to the inhumi if revealed " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "In the Nick Gevers interview, Wolfe is asked, in complex fashion, about the secret of the Inhumi. \nHere is Wolfe's answer:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "If human beings did not prey on one another, the inhumi could not prey on us. That's all. It isn't \ncomplicated, and I thought that everyone would get it. Maybe the thought of human beings not preying \non their own kind is just too foreign. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Wolfe's answer does not (to me) address nate's concern. Horn is clear that the secret of the Inhumi \nmust be something which, if revealed, would threaten their entire race. I'm not sure if Wolfe is being\ndeliberately unclear or whether he had forgotten this aspect of it with this answer.\n\nMy own answer tries (weakly) to springboard from Wolfe's answer. Those humans who prey on other humans\ngenerally rely on stealth and deception. Especially if we buy into Daniel Petersen's ideas regarding\nWolfe's libertarianism, humans who prey upon other humans are to be considered parasites. One way of\nbeing a parasite is to be a stowaway.\n\nApologies for rehashing a previous discussion but I think that's the inhumi secret which, if revealed,\nwould threaten their species. A parasitic species needs to be able to travel. Stuck in one place, they\nwould quickly deplete their hosts and be left without food. The secret is that inhumi cannot, as they\nclaim, fly through space. Given Wolfe's awareness of scientific detail, I don't think the impossibility\nof unassisted biological space travel is something that escapes his attention.\n\nSo, the inhumi are, by nature, a species which specializes in imitating a host and getting rides to other\nplanets on their spacecraft. We see this practice in two of the best known inhumi, Quetzal and Krait. If \nthis secret was revealed, the awareness and precautions would end up restricting the Inhumi to Green and \nend their species existence or at least their ability to expand outward. ??? ???????? ?????? ??? ? " } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Daniel Petersen", "address": "danielottojackpetersen at gmail.com" }, "date": "2012-11-26T16:21:16+00:00", "subject": "(urth) (no subject)", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " Especially if we buy into Daniel Petersen's ideas regarding\nWolfe's libertarianism, humans who prey upon other humans are to be\nconsidered parasites.\n\n\nForgive me for being pedantic and patronising, but I just want to make sure\neveryone understands I was talking about the concept of libertarian\nfreewill in analytic philosophy. I was not at all referencing the\npolitical position known as Libertarian (as distinct from Republican,\nDemocrat, etc.). Wolfe happens to be self-professedly the latter, but\nthat's not immediately relevant to a philosophical discussion about\nfreewill vs. determinism. (Is it?)\n\n-DOJP" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 3:20 PM, Lee Berman wrote:\nEspecially if we buy into Daniel Petersen's ideas regarding\nWolfe's libertarianism, humans who prey upon other humans are to be\nconsidered parasites." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Daniel Otto Jack Petersen" } ] }, { "message_id": "<1354048283.38470.YahooMailNeo@web84508.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>", "from": { "name": "DAVID STOCKHOFF", "address": "dstockhoff at verizon.net" }, "date": "2012-11-27T20:31:23+00:00", "subject": "(urth) (no subject)", "in_reply_to": "<1353944046.30660.YahooMailClassic@web160705.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [] }, { "message_id": "<50B5241D.3040404@irit.fr>", "from": { "name": "Sergei SOLOVIEV", "address": "soloviev at irit.fr" }, "date": "2012-11-27T20:35:41+00:00", "subject": "(urth) (no subject)", "in_reply_to": "<1354048283.38470.YahooMailNeo@web84508.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "The ritual occurs in the discussion with Juganu, in \"Return to the Whorl\" -\n\nSergei" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "DAVID STOCKHOFF wrote:\n\n------------------------------------------------------------------------\n*From:* Marc Aramini \n*To:* The Urth Mailing List \n*Sent:* Monday, November 26, 2012 10:34 AM\n*Subject:* Re: (urth) (no subject)\n\nthe secret of the inhumi is that they are all that is left of \nhumanity, a vestigial parasite that can no longer breed without a \nfresh infusion of human blood.\n \nFor all intents and purposes, they are humans, and their little mating \nritual where they pretend to be man and woman is just ontogeny \nrecapitulating philogeny.\n\n\n\nMarc\n\nWhere does this ritual occur in the text?\n\nDo you think Quetzal's remark about A-man and Wo-man going up the tree \nand not coming down again is related to this ritual (aside from the \npossibility that Urth is literally Green and that all inhumi are \ndescended from humans)?\n\n------------------------------------------------------------------------\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] } ] }