{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/6547", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 6547, "subject": "Free Live Free Two texts", "messages": 8, "voices": 3, "first": "2014-05-10T05:41:46+00:00", "last": "2014-05-22T02:09:25+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Austin Hackett", "address": "austin.hackett at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-10T05:41:46+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Hi, new member here. I joined up to find out which version of *Free Live\nFree* is preferable to read?\n\nI haven't read *Free Live Free* but plan on doing so soon. It just so\nhappens I have both the 1984 Mark V. Ziesing small press edition and the\nstandard 1986 Tor mass market version on my shelf. Several places online\nsay the Tor is shorter by about 4000 words. I also notice that it contains\na chronology (which, it says, was requested by the publisher) and the title\nof the first chapter is different. The order of some parts may also be\ndifferent between the two versions according to vague reports.\n\nDoes the Tor edition represent an editorially truncated text or the\nauthor's final revisions? Some might think \"longer = better\" but I don't\nwant to assume anything. Maybe Wolfe shortened the book at the behest of\nthe publisher, but he may have just revised it for his own artistic\npurposes. Even if the cuts were mandated, he may have taken the opportunity\nto make different changes as well. And none of these factors actually\ndetermine which version is *better*.\n\nSo has anyone read both, or at least knows a little about the backstory? I\ncan't find any info online.\n\nThanks!" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Antonin Scriabin", "address": "kierkegaurdian at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-10T16:03:43+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I just finished the 1984 version, and can't imagine doing without 4000\nwords. I haven't read the Tor version. I would say have the best of both\nworlds; read the longer version with the benefit of the chronology when you\nneed it. It was fantastic by the way, one of my favorite of his stand\nalones." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On May 10, 2014 1:41 AM, \"Austin Hackett\" wrote:\nHi, new member here. I joined up to find out which version of *Free Live\nFree* is preferable to read?\n\nI haven't read *Free Live Free* but plan on doing so soon. It just so\nhappens I have both the 1984 Mark V. Ziesing small press edition and the\nstandard 1986 Tor mass market version on my shelf. Several places online\nsay the Tor is shorter by about 4000 words. I also notice that it contains\na chronology (which, it says, was requested by the publisher) and the title\nof the first chapter is different. The order of some parts may also be\ndifferent between the two versions according to vague reports.\n\nDoes the Tor edition represent an editorially truncated text or the\nauthor's final revisions? Some might think \"longer = better\" but I don't\nwant to assume anything. Maybe Wolfe shortened the book at the behest of\nthe publisher, but he may have just revised it for his own artistic\npurposes. Even if the cuts were mandated, he may have taken the opportunity\nto make different changes as well. And none of these factors actually\ndetermine which version is *better*.\n\nSo has anyone read both, or at least knows a little about the backstory? I\ncan't find any info online.\n\nThanks!\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Marc Aramini", "address": "marcaramini at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-13T23:56:13+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "There are a few differences like chapter headings - \"selling weather\"\nbecomes \"four roomers of war\" in the first chapter a man named Norris\nidentified by his first name comes in looking for candy rather than sgt\nProudy looking for Free ... Words like might are changed to would, etc. I\nmay read them side by side when I get to 1984 in my review of Wolfe's\nfiction... I don't plan on doing new sun unless the spirit strikes me and I\nhave something new to say." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Saturday, May 10, 2014, Antonin Scriabin \nwrote:\nI just finished the 1984 version, and can't imagine doing without 4000\nwords. I haven't read the Tor version. I would say have the best of both\nworlds; read the longer version with the benefit of the chronology when you\nneed it. It was fantastic by the way, one of my favorite of his stand\nalones.\nOn May 10, 2014 1:41 AM, \"Austin Hackett\" >\nwrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Hi, new member here. I joined up to find out which version of *Free Live\nFree* is preferable to read?\n\nI haven't read *Free Live Free* but plan on doing so soon. It just so\nhappens I have both the 1984 Mark V. Ziesing small press edition and the\nstandard 1986 Tor mass market version on my shelf. Several places online\nsay the Tor is shorter by about 4000 words. I also notice that it contains\na chronology (which, it says, was requested by the publisher) and the title\nof the first chapter is different. The order of some parts may also be\ndifferent between the two versions according to vague reports.\n\nDoes the Tor edition represent an editorially truncated text or the\nauthor's final revisions? Some might think \"longer = better\" but I don't\nwant to assume anything. Maybe Wolfe shortened the book at the behest of\nthe publisher, but he may have just revised it for his own artistic\npurposes. Even if the cuts were mandated, he may have taken the opportunity\nto make different changes as well. And none of these factors actually\ndetermine which version is *better*.\n\nSo has anyone read both, or at least knows a little about the backstory?\nI can't find any info online.\n\nThanks!\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Marc Aramini", "address": "marcaramini at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-14T00:04:28+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Also, some subtextual clues have been layered into the tor version like the\nsounds of an airplane when free is just sitting there watching tv, etc.\n which will make sense as a detail when you finish the story." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Tuesday, May 13, 2014, Marc Aramini wrote:\nThere are a few differences like chapter headings - \"selling weather\"\nbecomes \"four roomers of war\" in the first chapter a man named Norris\nidentified by his first name comes in looking for candy rather than sgt\nProudy looking for Free ... Words like might are changed to would, etc. I\nmay read them side by side when I get to 1984 in my review of Wolfe's\nfiction... I don't plan on doing new sun unless the spirit strikes me and I\nhave something new to say.\n\nOn Saturday, May 10, 2014, Antonin Scriabin >\nwrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "I just finished the 1984 version, and can't imagine doing without 4000\nwords. I haven't read the Tor version. I would say have the best of both\nworlds; read the longer version with the benefit of the chronology when you\nneed it. It was fantastic by the way, one of my favorite of his stand\nalones.\nOn May 10, 2014 1:41 AM, \"Austin Hackett\" \nwrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "Hi, new member here. I joined up to find out which version of *Free\nLive Free* is preferable to read?\n\nI haven't read *Free Live Free* but plan on doing so soon. It just so\nhappens I have both the 1984 Mark V. Ziesing small press edition and the\nstandard 1986 Tor mass market version on my shelf. Several places online\nsay the Tor is shorter by about 4000 words. I also notice that it contains\na chronology (which, it says, was requested by the publisher) and the title\nof the first chapter is different. The order of some parts may also be\ndifferent between the two versions according to vague reports.\n\nDoes the Tor edition represent an editorially truncated text or the\nauthor's final revisions? Some might think \"longer = better\" but I don't\nwant to assume anything. Maybe Wolfe shortened the book at the behest of\nthe publisher, but he may have just revised it for his own artistic\npurposes. Even if the cuts were mandated, he may have taken the opportunity\nto make different changes as well. And none of these factors actually\ndetermine which version is *better*.\n\nSo has anyone read both, or at least knows a little about the backstory?\nI can't find any info online.\n\nThanks!\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Austin Hackett", "address": "austin.hackett at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-18T07:48:49+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Give the nature of these differences, it seems to me like the Tor version\nmay be preferable, as it represents the author's final intentions... still\na tough call." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Tue, May 13, 2014 at 5:04 PM, Marc Aramini wrote:\nAlso, some subtextual clues have been layered into the tor version like\nthe sounds of an airplane when free is just sitting there watching tv, etc.\n which will make sense as a detail when you finish the story.\n\n\nOn Tuesday, May 13, 2014, Marc Aramini wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "There are a few differences like chapter headings - \"selling weather\"\nbecomes \"four roomers of war\" in the first chapter a man named Norris\nidentified by his first name comes in looking for candy rather than sgt\nProudy looking for Free ... Words like might are changed to would, etc. I\nmay read them side by side when I get to 1984 in my review of Wolfe's\nfiction... I don't plan on doing new sun unless the spirit strikes me and I\nhave something new to say.\n\nOn Saturday, May 10, 2014, Antonin Scriabin \nwrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 3, "text": "I just finished the 1984 version, and can't imagine doing without 4000\nwords. I haven't read the Tor version. I would say have the best of both\nworlds; read the longer version with the benefit of the chronology when you\nneed it. It was fantastic by the way, one of my favorite of his stand\nalones.\nOn May 10, 2014 1:41 AM, \"Austin Hackett\" \nwrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 4, "text": "Hi, new member here. I joined up to find out which version of *Free\nLive Free* is preferable to read?\n\nI haven't read *Free Live Free* but plan on doing so soon. It just so\nhappens I have both the 1984 Mark V. Ziesing small press edition and the\nstandard 1986 Tor mass market version on my shelf. Several places online\nsay the Tor is shorter by about 4000 words. I also notice that it contains\na chronology (which, it says, was requested by the publisher) and the title\nof the first chapter is different. The order of some parts may also be\ndifferent between the two versions according to vague reports.\n\nDoes the Tor edition represent an editorially truncated text or the\nauthor's final revisions? Some might think \"longer = better\" but I don't\nwant to assume anything. Maybe Wolfe shortened the book at the behest of\nthe publisher, but he may have just revised it for his own artistic\npurposes. Even if the cuts were mandated, he may have taken the opportunity\nto make different changes as well. And none of these factors actually\ndetermine which version is *better*.\n\nSo has anyone read both, or at least knows a little about the\nbackstory? I can't find any info online.\n\nThanks!\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Marc Aramini", "address": "marcaramini at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-20T05:22:09+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Yes I think the tor version is the one to go with as the final draft.\n There are a few scenes which are shorter in that version and one chapter\ntaken out that changes stubb's character a little bit. I have jotted down\nmost of the significant differences and when you are done with the novel\nyou can read my upcoming post, maybe I will finish it by the end of this\nweek, but it will have spoilers so wait until you are done with the novel.\n\nA few of the interesting but minor changes: Barnes' age goes from 41 to 34.\n A character asked about communing with demons gives an unqualified yes in\nthe ziesing text but in the tor version hedges them as having \"other, and\nbetter, names.\"" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Austin Hackett", "address": "austin.hackett at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-22T01:13:24+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Thanks-- can't wait to see your enumeration of the significant variances.\nThat is exactly what I was looking for but couldn't find, leading me to\nthis mailing list. Clearly the right path!" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Mon, May 19, 2014 at 10:22 PM, Marc Aramini wrote:\nYes I think the tor version is the one to go with as the final draft.\n There are a few scenes which are shorter in that version and one chapter\ntaken out that changes stubb's character a little bit. I have jotted down\nmost of the significant differences and when you are done with the novel\nyou can read my upcoming post, maybe I will finish it by the end of this\nweek, but it will have spoilers so wait until you are done with the novel.\n\nA few of the interesting but minor changes: Barnes' age goes from 41 to\n34. A character asked about communing with demons gives an unqualified yes\nin the ziesing text but in the tor version hedges them as having \"other,\nand better, names.\"\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Marc Aramini", "address": "marcaramini at gmail.com" }, "date": "2014-05-22T02:09:25+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Free Live Free Two texts", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "It is under the section titled \"revisions\" of my post earlier today located\nhere http://lists.urth.net/pipermail/urth-urth.net/2014-May/054808.html ...\nBut as I said don't read it until you are done or you will be super\nspoiled." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Wednesday, May 21, 2014, Austin Hackett wrote:\nThanks-- can't wait to see your enumeration of the significant variances.\nThat is exactly what I was looking for but couldn't find, leading me to\nthis mailing list. Clearly the right path!\n\n\nOn Mon, May 19, 2014 at 10:22 PM, Marc Aramini \nwrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Yes I think the tor version is the one to go with as the final draft.\n There are a few scenes which are shorter in that version and one chapter\ntaken out that changes stubb's character a little bit. I have jotted down\nmost of the significant differences and when you are done with the novel\nyou can read my upcoming post, maybe I will finish it by the end of this\nweek, but it will have spoilers so wait until you are done with the novel.\n\nA few of the interesting but minor changes: Barnes' age goes from 41 to\n34. A character asked about communing with demons gives an unqualified yes\nin the ziesing text but in the tor version hedges them as having \"other,\nand better, names.\"\n\n_______________________________________________" } ] } ] }