{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/6718", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 6718, "subject": "The Archives are missing", "messages": 9, "voices": 5, "first": "2015-04-06T14:03:44+00:00", "last": "2015-04-22T18:20:56+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "<55229240.3030102@verizon.net>", "from": { "name": "David Stockhoff", "address": "dstockhoff at verizon.net" }, "date": "2015-04-06T14:03:44+00:00", "subject": "(urth) The Archives are missing", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I recall being upset by that as well. The cosmology was hard enough as \nit was. That statement collapsed everything into meaninglessness." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 4/2/2015 3:18 PM, Robin B. Smith wrote:\nI recall the equating of Setr with Garsecg and the confusion it caused \nme, since at the time of reading I was aware of how exacting an author \nWolfe is.\n\nOn Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 1:59 PM, Charles Gillingham \n> wrote:\n\n I'm sure this as been discussed before, but was the point of the\n \"I\"? Was it a typo that Nettle left in? Or was that Horn saying,\n after that point, he was a real character in the story, and not\n some background character? Or was that just something Horn was\n proud of doing?\n\n _______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<5536D159.8000703@verizon.net>", "from": { "name": "David Stockhoff", "address": "dstockhoff at verizon.net" }, "date": "2015-04-21T22:38:17+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "<55229240.3030102@verizon.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I just encountered a new word---that is, a word that's new to me. Not, \nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its \nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\nI'll just quote from the Wiki and let people draw their own conclusions \nabout Latro's name in the context of Wolfe's theories about gods and God.\n\n*Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: ????? (monos) = single, and ??????? \n(latreia) = worship) is the recognition of the existence of many gods, \nbut with the consistent worship of only one deity.\n\nAn example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "marcaramini", "address": "marcaramini at gmail.com" }, "date": "2015-04-21T22:56:55+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "<5536D159.8000703@verizon.net>", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": " \nJives pretty well with my idea of what Latro is (ahura mazda incognito, learning to shun war in a trial run full of human suffering which will lead to the shifting from pagan gods to Christian monotheism as the pagan gods are reconciled to a new divine order)\n\n\nSent via the Samsung Galaxy Alpha?, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone\n\n-------- Original message --------\nFrom: David Stockhoff \nDate: 04/21/2015 3:38 PM (GMT-07:00) \nTo: The Urth Mailing List \nSubject: (urth) \"Latro\" \n\nI just encountered a new word---that is, a word that's new to me. Not, \nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its \nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\nI'll just quote from the Wiki and let people draw their own conclusions \nabout Latro's name in the context of Wolfe's theories about gods and God.\n\n*Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: ????? (monos) = single, and ??????? \n(latreia) = worship) is the recognition of the existence of many gods, \nbut with the consistent worship of only one deity.\n\nAn example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism." } ] }, { "message_id": "<5535FFE70025B76B@rgout01.bt.lon5.cpcloud.co.uk>", "from": { "name": "Mo Holkar", "address": "mo at holkar.net" }, "date": "2015-04-22T09:42:26+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "<5536D159.8000703@verizon.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "\"-latry\" as a suffix can be found with a number \nof other prefixes, perhaps most familiarly in \n\"idolatry\". Of course Wolfe was thinking of the \nplay on latro in Latin meaning thief, while \nlatreia in Greek means worship: but it seems a \nbit of a stretch of inference to see hidden \nmeaning in the \"mono-\" prefixed version specifically?\n\nbest,\n\nMo" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "At 23:38 21/04/2015, David wrote:\nContent-Transfer-Encoding: base64I just \nencountered a new word---that is, a word that's new to me. Not,\nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its\nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\nI'll just quote from the Wiki and let people \ndraw their own conclusions about Latro's name in \nthe context of Wolfe's theories about gods and God.\n\n*Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: \n????s??\"?????2??6??v???d ?????????????H?]?ZXJHH????\\\nH\\?H?X????][?? of the existence of many gods, \nbut with the consistent worship of only one deity.\n\nAn example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism.\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "danldo at gmail.com" }, "date": "2015-04-22T15:42:20+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "<5536D159.8000703@verizon.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "For what it's worth, \"-latry\" is an important term in Catholicism, usually\nin the form \"latria.\" Latria is the worship to which only God is\nentititled; what we offer to the saints in general is \"dulia,\" respect or\nreverence, and to Mary, \"hyperdulia,\" extreme reverence.\n\nWolfe just *might* know that...:)" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 2:42 AM, Mo Holkar wrote:\n\"-latry\" as a suffix can be found with a number of other prefixes, perhaps\nmost familiarly in \"idolatry\". Of course Wolfe was thinking of the play on\nlatro in Latin meaning thief, while latreia in Greek means worship: but it\nseems a bit of a stretch of inference to see hidden meaning in the \"mono-\"\nprefixed version specifically?\n\nbest,\n\nMo\n\n\n\nAt 23:38 21/04/2015, David wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64I just encountered a new word---that is,\na word that's new to me. Not,\nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its\nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\nI'll just quote from the Wiki and let people draw their own conclusions\nabout Latro's name in the context of Wolfe's theories about gods and God.\n\n*Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: ????s??\"?????2??6??v???d ???????\n?????H?]?ZXJHH????\\\nH\\?H?X????][?? of the existence of many gods, but with the consistent\nworship of only one deity.\n\nAn example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism.\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<5537CE03.5060207@verizon.net>", "from": { "name": "David Stockhoff", "address": "dstockhoff at verizon.net" }, "date": "2015-04-22T16:36:19+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I hadn't heard your theory. Interesting!" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 4/21/2015 6:56 PM, marcaramini wrote:\nJives pretty well with my idea of what Latro is (ahura mazda \nincognito, learning to shun war in a trial run full of human suffering \nwhich will lead to the shifting from pagan gods to Christian \nmonotheism as the pagan gods are reconciled to a new divine order)\n\n\n\nSent via the Samsung Galaxy Alpha?, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone\n\n\n-------- Original message --------\nFrom: David Stockhoff \nDate: 04/21/2015 3:38 PM (GMT-07:00)\nTo: The Urth Mailing List \nSubject: (urth) \"Latro\"\n\nI just encountered a new word---that is, a word that's new to me. Not,\nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its\nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\nI'll just quote from the Wiki and let people draw their own conclusions\nabout Latro's name in the context of Wolfe's theories about gods and God.\n\n*Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: ????? (monos) = single, and ???????\n(latreia) = worship) is the recognition of the existence of many gods,\nbut with the consistent worship of only one deity.\n\nAn example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism.\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<5537CEF9.6070408@verizon.net>", "from": { "name": "David Stockhoff", "address": "dstockhoff at verizon.net" }, "date": "2015-04-22T16:40:25+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "<5535FFE70025B76B@rgout01.bt.lon5.cpcloud.co.uk>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Right, the \"mono\" is a separate idea from the \"latry.\" It seems relevant \non its own but it led me to \"latry.\"\n\nYes: thief/mercenary + worship(er) seems an interesting combination. \nEspecially given how Latro seems to have received his head wound: \ndespoiling a shrine after a battle, IIRC." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 4/22/2015 5:42 AM, Mo Holkar wrote:\n\"-latry\" as a suffix can be found with a number of other prefixes, \nperhaps most familiarly in \"idolatry\". Of course Wolfe was thinking of \nthe play on latro in Latin meaning thief, while latreia in Greek means \nworship: but it seems a bit of a stretch of inference to see hidden \nmeaning in the \"mono-\" prefixed version specifically?\n\nbest,\n\nMo\n\n\n\nAt 23:38 21/04/2015, David wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64I just encountered a new word---that \nis, a word that's new to me. Not,\nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its\nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\nI'll just quote from the Wiki and let people draw their own \nconclusions about Latro's name in the context of Wolfe's theories \nabout gods and God.\n\n*Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: ????s??\"?????2??6??v???d \n?????????????H?]?ZXJHH????\\\nH\\?H?X????][?? of the existence of many gods, but with the consistent \nworship of only one deity.\n\nAn example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism.\n_______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<5537D0D6.2000709@verizon.net>", "from": { "name": "David Stockhoff", "address": "dstockhoff at verizon.net" }, "date": "2015-04-22T16:48:22+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Huh! That suggests another dimension to \"thief,\" since a thief takes \nwhat he is not \"entitled\" to. But I wouldn't know where to go from \nthere, unless another god is involved. Thus, Marc's theory that Latro is \nAhura Mazda fits, because AM would be taking God's rightful worship.\n\nI didn't know that meaning of \"-dule,\" which I have always seen rendered \nas \"slave.\" Hierodules need not be slaves at all. In fact, if they are \nanalogous to saints, it might be debatable whether they are meant to \ngive reverence or receive it. Or both." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 4/22/2015 11:42 AM, Dan'l Danehy-Oakes wrote:\nFor what it's worth, \"-latry\" is an important term in Catholicism, \nusually in the form \"latria.\" Latria is the worship to which only God \nis entititled; what we offer to the saints in general is \"dulia,\" \nrespect or reverence, and to Mary, \"hyperdulia,\" extreme reverence.\n\nWolfe just *might* know that...:)\n\nOn Wed, Apr 22, 2015 at 2:42 AM, Mo Holkar > wrote:\n\n \"-latry\" as a suffix can be found with a number of other prefixes,\n perhaps most familiarly in \"idolatry\". Of course Wolfe was\n thinking of the play on latro in Latin meaning thief, while\n latreia in Greek means worship: but it seems a bit of a stretch of\n inference to see hidden meaning in the \"mono-\" prefixed version\n specifically?\n\n best,\n\n Mo\n\n\n\n At 23:38 21/04/2015, David wrote:\n\n Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64I just encountered a new\n word---that is, a word that's new to me. Not,\n I'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it,\n though its\n similarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too.\n\n I'll just quote from the Wiki and let people draw their own\n conclusions about Latro's name in the context of Wolfe's\n theories about gods and God.\n\n *Monolatrism or monolatry* (Greek: ????s??\"?????2??6??v???d\n ??????? ?????H?]?ZXJHH????\\\n H\\?H?X????][?? of the existence of many gods, but with the\n consistent worship of only one deity.\n\n An example given is Akhenaten's heresy, Atenism.\n _______________________________________________" } ] }, { "message_id": "<5537E688.9080802@clueland.com>", "from": { "name": "Jeffery Wilson clueland.com", "address": "jwilson at clueland.com" }, "date": "2015-04-22T18:20:56+00:00", "subject": "(urth) \"Latro\"", "in_reply_to": "<5536D159.8000703@verizon.net>", "reply_link": "header", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On 4/21/2015 5:38 PM, David Stockhoff wrote:\nI just encountered a new word---that is, a word that's new to me. Not,\nI'm sure, to this forum. The Greek root is only part of it, though its\nsimilarity to \"Latro\" is new to me too." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "\"Idolatry\" is similarly similar to \"Latro\" than \"Monolatry\"." }, { "kind": "sig", "depth": 0, "text": "Jeff Wilson - < jwilson at clueland.com >\nA&M Texarkana Computational Intelligence Lab\n< http://www.tamut.edu/cil >" } ] } ] }