{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/856", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "urth", "thread": { "id": 856, "subject": "Marsch as spy?", "messages": 2, "voices": 2, "first": "1998-06-24T10:34:09+00:00", "last": "1998-06-24T15:57:51+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "adam louis stephanides", "address": "astephan at students.uiuc.edu" }, "date": "1998-06-24T10:34:09+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Marsch as spy?", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Mon, 22 Jun 1998 Sgt. Rock wrote:\nI've been wondering: why does everyone buy into the notion that Marsch\nwas killed by V.R.T. It seems to me that in 5th Head, _everything_ is\npossible, and here one obvious possibility has been overlooked: Marsch\nis, precisely as his Kafkaesque captors insist, a spy and assassin.\n(Consider Wolfe's fascination with spies in, e.g. the Long Sun books.\nThere is a positive abundance of spies in the Whorl.) The clues that he\nis an abo have been deliberately planted by Marsch to mislead his\ninterrogators. In particular, his writings are full of disinformation\ndesigned to create doubt about his identity and intentions.\n\nIn fact, Marsch has a double cover story: first, that he is an\nanthropologist from earth. This primary cover is the one he used when\nmoving about Port-Mimizon. He activated his secondary cover when he was\narrested: hoping to take advantage of the Sainte Croix natives'\nignorance of \"abos\", he began to pretend that he was an abo trying to\npass as an anthropologist from Earth. " }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "My main objection to this theory is that it makes for a worse book, IMO.\nBut apart from that, I see two major problems:\n\n1) Pretending to be an abo impersonating an Earthman would hardly free him\nfrom suspicion of being a spy. There's no reason why such an impersonator\ncouldn't also be carrying out a mission from the Annese government. In\nfact, given the Ste.Croix regime's paranoia, Marsch's being an Annese\nvisiting Ste. Croix in the guise of an Earthman would probably be regarded\nas tantamount in itself to being a spy.\n\n2) How do you account for the three years Marsch spends in the wilderness\n(or at any rate on St. Anne) after he has supposedly established his\nsecondary cover story of being an abo? His mission on Ste. Croix must not\nhave been very urgent.\n\nThe first problem can be gotten round if we assume that Marsch is a spy\n*from Earth*, and that his concern is not to avoid being arrested, but to\navoid having it realized that he is acting for Earth. Then the pretense\nof being an Annese would be a red herring designed to pander to the Ste.\nCroix authorities' preconceptions and lead them down a false trail. This\nmight also explain his three years on St. Anne: he's spying for Earth\nthere. I still don't like this theory, but I think it works better than\nyour original proposal. And I have to admit that I can't quite dismiss it\nout of hand, because of the little mysteries surrounding Marsch that\nmantis and Robert Borski have pointed out mean\nthat I " }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "What happened in that \"short time\"? I think either Marsch or Number 5\nkilled Maitre. Perhaps there was a pre-arrangement whereby the two would\nact together when Number 5 voiced his accusation. In either case, they\nparted in agreement: Number 5 would take \"credit\" for the crime, do his\ntime, and inherit." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "This theory can be disposed of more easily, on two grounds:\n\n1) Why would Number Five agree to take \"credit\" for the crime? It won't\nhelp him inherit. On the contrary, \"A criminal may not profit by his\ncrime\" and that Number Five does wind up with the house couldn't have been\nforeseen at the time (76, Ace edition). In any case, there's no\npre-arrangement, because Number Five only develops his plan to kill Maitre\non the night of the murder, and he is surprised to see Marsch with his\nfather. (68-69). Of course, it could be that Number Five is lying about\nthis, and that he accepts blame for the murder because he himself is a\npartisan or agent of Earth, but this is going far afield from the text,\nwith no reason.\n\n2) For somebody with as much foresight as you posit Marsch as having, his\npostulated plan to kill Maitre is remarkably bad: be seen publicly\nentering the house, kill Maitre or be there when the murder is committed,\nand then return to his apartment where he can easily be arrested.\n\n--Adam" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Peter Cash", "address": "cash at rsn.hp.com" }, "date": "1998-06-24T15:57:51+00:00", "subject": "(urth) Marsch as spy?", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "adam louis stephanides wrote:\n1) Pretending to be an abo impersonating an Earthman would hardly free him\nfrom suspicion of being a spy. There's no reason why such an impersonator\ncouldn't also be carrying out a mission from the Annese government. In\nfact, given the Ste.Croix regime's paranoia, Marsch's being an Annese\nvisiting Ste. Croix in the guise of an Earthman would probably be regarded\nas tantamount in itself to being a spy." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Of course. That's why Marsch only activates the second cover when he has\ngood reason to think his first one is blown (when the authorities arrest\nhim and accuse him of being an Annese spy). Marsch is using the\ntime-honored tactic of \"confessing\" to a lesser crime (murder) to draw\nsuspicion from his true activities (spying). No, I don't think that\nMarsch believed this pretense would get him off, but he was still\npresumably acting out of loyalty to his employers. " }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "2) How do you account for the three years Marsch spends in the wilderness\n(or at any rate on St. Anne) after he has supposedly established his\nsecondary cover story of being an abo? His mission on Ste. Croix must not\nhave been very urgent." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Perhaps he was going to advanced spy school. Or maybe waiting for the\nright time. " }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "The first problem can be gotten round if we assume that Marsch is a spy\n*from Earth*, and that his concern is not to avoid being arrested, but to\navoid having it realized that he is acting for Earth. Then the pretense\nof being an Annese would be a red herring designed to pander to the Ste.\nCroix authorities' preconceptions and lead them down a false trail. This\nmight also explain his three years on St. Anne: he's spying for Earth\nthere. I still don't like this theory, but I think it works better than\nyour original proposal. And I have to admit that I can't quite dismiss it\nout of hand, because of the little mysteries surrounding Marsch that" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Ah, but then there's alga's green eyes, which can only be found on\nAnnese! Still, it's an interesting theory...at least you agree that it's\nnot entirely out of the question that Herr Marsch is a spy of some sort!" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "This theory can be disposed of more easily, on two grounds:" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "It's weak, I agree, and your reasons are good. Still, Wolfe never shows\nus the actual crime, and this fires the Sergeant's febrile imagination\nfurther...\n\nFurthermore, isn't it odd that the St. Croix authorities not only accuse\nMarsch of being a spy, but also of murdering Maitre? After all, they've\nalready convicted Number 5 for the same crime. Is there perhaps some\nreason for thinking that the two were acting in collusion? \n\nBringing you the best in deviant thinking,\nSgt. Rock" } ] } ] }