{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/urth/918",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "urth",
  "thread": {
    "id": 918,
    "subject": "Lukos family tree; leukos",
    "messages": 1,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "1998-07-04T17:25:37+00:00",
    "last": "1998-07-04T17:25:37+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<urth-v0015-0112@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Robert Borski",
        "address": "rborski at coredcs.com"
      },
      "date": "1998-07-04T17:25:37+00:00",
      "subject": "(urth) Lukos family tree; leukos",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "With his head well above water, about 666 posts ago (+/-100), Welshian sawn\nprion wrote:\n\n\"First, about the original Jeannine in the photo.  Aunt Jeannine tells\nNo. 5 that she will show him a picture of his true mother, and gives\nhim the photo of the woman and child.  If this is his mother, it must\nbe his biological one, since a clone, like anyone else, has no other\nkind.  If it is No. 5's biological mother, then she must be the\nbiological mother of the original Gene Wolfe, and thus would not be\nmarried to her son, as is shown in your timeline, and is part of the\nsource of the confusion I discussed in my original post.\"\n\nI've now revised my Fifth head Geneology in light of this (thanks for\nclarifying it--I was clearly the muddleheaded one).\n\nI'm now contending the second generation of St. Croix's Wolfe clan is all\nnatural; i.e., that Gene Wolfe II and Jeannine are both naturally born. The\nfirst clone is subsequently created by Gene Wolfe II; this clone is Maitre\n(who kills his father when he finds out, as does Number Five.) Thus the\npicture Jeannine shows Number Five does depict both parents, since he's a\nclone of their naturally-born son. Make sense? I should have the revised\nfamily tree CC graphic uploaded by the time you see this, if you'd like to\ntake a look.\n\nAs for the revisionism, there does not appear to be anything in the text\nthat directly contradicts this.\n\nConsider the following (which I've quoted often). Maitre is the speaker: \"I\nam here because the individual behind me did--who was himself originated by\nthe one whose mind is simulated in Mr. Million.\" *Originated* does not\nnecessarily have to mean \"cloned\" here; it could be the old-fashioned\nnormal reproductive process--the fun, non-vitro method.\n\nThen there's the following from Dr. Marsch, who's talking about Aunt\nJeannine: \"She is in reality daughter to an earlier--shall we say\n'version'?--of yourself?\" Again, note the pesky quote marks around version.\nThey're unnecessary--unless, of course, Wolfe is attempting to key us to\nsomething--in this case the \"version\" being discussed--despite the same\nname--is the original Gene Wolfe, who provides only half the genetic makeup\nwe find in Gene Wolfe II (Mrs. GW provides the other half). Gene Wolfe II,\nhowever, provides all of the genetic material for Gene Wolfe III, the first\nclone.  \n\nPrion also wrote in regards to my Hero post:  \"You say that Paul\n'marries' her, but doesn't consummate the marriage.\"\n\nYes he marries her, but no he doesn't consummate the union--not because the\ntwo of them don't have enough time together, but because Janey is still\nlukos; i.e., a soulless animal and therefore unredeemed. For Paul to\nattempt consummation would thus be tantamount to bestiality--as opposed to\nthe sacred union of love St. Paul and the Church advocate. Once Janey is\nredeemed, however, she becomes leucos, light; i.e., she is no longer an\nanimal and can now join her husband in reaping the fruits of blessed\nmatrimony.\n\nHope this helps.\n\nRobert Borski (scolex) "
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}