{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/1152", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "whorl", "thread": { "id": 1152, "subject": "A Bite of Night Chough, er, Crow (with spoilers du jour)", "messages": 2, "voices": 2, "first": "2001-02-13T19:18:00+00:00", "last": "2001-02-13T21:13:36+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dave Lebling", "address": "dlebling at shore.net" }, "date": "2001-02-13T21:13:36+00:00", "subject": "(whorl) A Bite of Night Chough, er, Crow (with spoilers du jour)", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "<\nTo Adam Stephanides and vizcacha: are you now still going to argue that Silk\nhas suffered a failure of nerve and cut himself not only on the arms, but\nhis hands, his face and his neck too?>>\n\nOk, I concede on the details. However, I still think Silk was passively\ncommitting suicide and his spirit was broken. Hyacinth was dead. Silk was\nunable to prevent this. He is injured, bleeding to death. Devoted husband\nand general good-guy that he is, he places Hyacinth on her bier and settles\ndown to die himself. In the nick of time Horn's spirit infuses his brain,\nsuppressing his depression and defeatism, his wish for death. Horn is a\ncan-do kind of guy, he won't let himself bleed to death for no reason.\n\nSo, to discuss the implications...\n\nThe unnamed farmer and his wife appear to know of Hyacinth living at the\nmanse: \"Some woman's there now. Came out from the city, I guess.\" Note there\nis no mention of Silk here. Did Silk and Hyacinth live apart? \"Said she was\nsick.\" \"She looked sick, too.\" So, this seems to at least suggest Hyacinth\ndied of natural causes. No injuries to her are mentioned. Someone,\npresumably Silk, laid her on the bier.\n\nSo, how was Silk injured? Possibilities:\n\n1) He did it himself.\n\nIn favor: Occam's Razor.\nAgainst: clumsy suicide attempt for a guy who was a \"butcher.\"\n\n2) The manse was attacked.\n\nFor: eliminates clumsy suicide objection. Various candidates: Pig,\nopposition political groups in Viron, actual godling, Hari Mau & Co. Also\nfarmer's attitude is suspicious (see below).\nAgainst: timing is very coincidental as compared with both Hy's death and\nHorn's on Green. One of these is bad enough, two is awful, but three? I try\nnot to swallow too many coincidences before breakfast. Also, a lack of\n_plausible_ candidates.\n\n3) Candidates for an attack.\n\na) Pig.\nFor: farmer's comment about fighting off a small godling. Pig is clearly\nsuch.\nAgainst: Pig has changed his ways since being possessed (but maybe not\ncompletely).\n\nb) opposition party\nFor: Mint was attacked, Bison is scared that Silk will come back and resume\nthe exodus, nutcases abound.\nAgainst: No hint or evidence that I can see.\n\nc) actual godling\nFor: there's one in the vicinity.\nAgainst: he shows no interest in hurting Silk later on.\n\nd) Hari Mau & Co.\nFor: opportunity. They went out to the manse.\nAgainst: no motive, they want him alive.\n\nLet's look at Pig as suspect again, though as I said, I find it an\nunattractive scenario.\n\nLater in the story, at the ruins of Blood's mansion, Pig is a serious danger\nto Hound and Horn/Silk when he is mourning Hyacinth in a room she once\noccupied. It is not hard to imagine a scenario where Pig happens upon (or is\ndirected to) Silk's manse (Hyacinth's cottage?). There he finds Hyacinth,\ndead, and goes into an even more dangerous mourning fugue than we see later\nat Blood's. (How does he know it's Hyacinth? He's blind. Her scent?) Silk\ncomes in (Where was he? Why did the farmers only know Hyacinth?) Pig attacks\nSilk and does some damage, but flees. (Why? Does he recognize that he's\nattacking himself? Is Silk winning? If there was a fight, why doesn't Pig\nappear injured not much later? Why is Pig so friendly to Horn/Silk when he\nmeets him just one day later?)\n\nSome other loose ends. The farmers clearly recognized Silk as Silk:\n\n \"Do either of you know Patera Silk? Calde Silk of Viron?\"\n Neither spoke. They edged closer together, regarding him through slitted\neyes.\n\nThen a few pages later the farmer tries to drive Silk off with his stick. Is\nhe afraid of Silk because the farmer knew of an attack on the manse and\nthinks Silk knows he was complicit in it, if only by silence? He denies even\nknowing Silk lived in the neighborhood, and casually mentions that he has a\nslug gun.\n\nI don't know what to conclude. In honor of Pig's native culture, the jury\nreturns \"Not Proven.\" The colophon of the Urth list seems very appropriate\nhere.\n\n Dave Lebling\n aka vizcacha\n\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "David DiGiacomo", "address": "dd at adobe.com" }, "date": "2001-02-13T19:18:00+00:00", "subject": "Re: (whorl) A Bite of Night Chough, er, Crow (with spoilers du jour)", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "On the matter of Silk's wounds:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "From: dlebling at shore.net (Dave Lebling)\n1) He did it himself.\n\nIn favor: Occam's Razor.\nAgainst: clumsy suicide attempt for a guy who was a \"butcher.\"" }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "I think that he cut himself because he wanted blood for Hyacinth's final\nsacrifice. He wouldn't have wanted to die until he had completed it." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "3) Candidates for an attack.\n\na) Pig.\nFor: farmer's comment about fighting off a small godling. Pig is clearly\nsuch.\nAgainst: Pig has changed his ways since being possessed (but maybe not\ncompletely)." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Against: Pig is armed with a large sword, which would tend to make one\nlarge wound, as opposed to many small ones. I suppose Pig could have\ntaken the sword from Silk after attacking him with the knife - but I\nthought it was intended to be Silk's old sacrificial knife." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "c) actual godling\nFor: there's one in the vicinity.\nAgainst: he shows no interest in hurting Silk later on." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Against: Silk would have been squashed, not cut." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "Then a few pages later the farmer tries to drive Silk off with his stick. Is\nhe afraid of Silk because the farmer knew of an attack on the manse and\nthinks Silk knows he was complicit in it, if only by silence? He denies even\nknowing Silk lived in the neighborhood, and casually mentions that he has a\nslug gun." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Perhaps Silk went on a rampage through the manse and grounds after\nHyacinth's death, frightening the farmers.\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun." } ] } ] }