{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/1158",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "whorl",
  "thread": {
    "id": 1158,
    "subject": "RTTW failures",
    "messages": 1,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "2000-02-16T13:15:56+00:00",
    "last": "2000-02-16T13:15:56+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<whorl-v0012-0221@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Allan Lloyd",
        "address": "lloyd at nexus.kc3.co.uk"
      },
      "date": "2000-02-16T13:15:56+00:00",
      "subject": "(whorl) RTTW failures",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "I just wanted to agree with some of the things Alga said about RTTW and\nadd some of my own comments.\n\nAlthough there are of course many good things in RTTW, overall I found\nit one of the most disappointing of Wolfe's books.  The initial\nimpression of the cover right through to the awful proof reading make it\nseem an unattractive and rushed book.\n\nAs Alga said, Pig's accent is extremely annoying (it sounds more\nNewcastle Geordie than Scottish to me), but his whole character does not\nconvince. Compare Pig to Auk, both performing similar functions in their\nrespective books. When Auk suffers from concussion in the tunnels we\nfeel real sympathy and concern for him, and although he is a violent\ncriminal he has redeeming qualities which make him a well rounded\ncharacter. Pig does nothing but fawn over Horn/Silk and whine about his\ne'en. Like Alga, I feel that I am being manipulated into feeling sorry\nfor him. Giving someone a quirky way of speaking is a very lazy way of\nshowing character, and is an increasingly worrying feature of Wolfe's\nrecent work.\n\nOther points in the book that did not work for me-\n\n1.  Projecting astral versions of yourself to other planets is a\nconvenient and unbelievable fantasy gimmick which may work in Edgar Rice\nBurroughs, but does not sit well with the predominantly sf approach of\nthe rest of the book. Even the time travel in BOTNS is given some\njustification, but I find instantaneous projection over a distance that\nhas taken the Whorl 300 years to travel completely unconvincing. And\nwhen the various groups are in their astral bodies, how can we read\nabout Oreb without laughing. The image of Oreb as a child of four with\nfeathers, or a feathered dwarf instantly stops your suspension of\nbelief. The image is straight from Sesame Street or the Muppets.\n\n2.  We are asked to believe that faithful Oreb, the most honest\ncharacter in the book, has been possessed by Scylla for most of the\nthree books. This is the violent jealous Scylla who, when possessing\nChenille, first ordered the sacrifice of a harmless fisherman, then\nchanged her mind to request the sacrifice of 50 to 100 babies to attract\nher attention. So all the time Oreb has been possessed by a cruel\nvindictive Goddess. Often in Wolfe's books I don't understand what is\nhappening, so I read again and again to try to work out the meaning.\nThis is the first time that I have simply not been convinced. The idea\nreads like something that was tacked on just to produce a shock, with\nlittle preperation or purpose. \n\n3.  Seawrack. In the first book, Seawrack is a significant part of the\naction. We want to know more about her, why she is given to Horn, what\nis the motive of the Mother. So in the next two books she is just\nforgotten. Like Dorcas, she emerges from the water, supports the\nprotagonist, and then is casually dumped. It is almost as if Wolfe\nthought \"sea voyage, Odyssey, must have a Siren\" and then lost interest.\nThis makes her offstage reunion with Silk at the end of the book seem\ncasual and pointless, and I fail to see her motive in joining the return\nto the Whorl.\n\n4.  The Neighbors. Mysterious Aborigines are appearing with alarming\nregularity in Wolfe's books, and are becoming a bit of a cliche.\nAll-powerful near-supernatural beings are very useful for getting your\nhero out of a jam, but in this case come across as just one more layer\nof plot manipulators. Horn is given a magic ring so that he can see\nthem, loses it on Green, is presented with a replacement which changes\nsize and colour at random (why?). This is the stuff of fantasy and does\nnot fit the atmosphere of the book.\n   And why give the neighbors (and the other fauna of Blue) a double\nquota of arms, legs and eyes? To see why it does not work, look at the\nNeighbor on the cover of IGJ. This is the worst sort of science fiction\nshorthand, a gimmick that saves the trouble of original thought. Can you\nimagine an ur-elephant with eight legs, two trunks and four eyes?\n\n5.  The Horn/Silk/Horn question has been discussed enough already. All I\nwant to add is that I found the final revelation contrived and\nunconvincing, a bit like the final twist to a horror movie, there\nbecause there always is a final twist.\n\n6.  Can anyone explain why Merryn should be Severian's sister. There was\nno sign of recognition in their scene together in BOTNS, and there seems\nno reason that they should be related. Just because they are similar\nages and both probable orphans, they have to be siblings. Shakespearian\ncoincidence again?\n\nI have probably given the impression that I hated RTTW. On the contrary\nI loved much of it, and wanted it to be much better. But I think, like\nAlga, that Gene lost interest towards the end and just wanted to finish\nthe book.  \n\n                     Allan Lloyd\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun."
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}