Subject: (whorl) mantis on TBOTSS and fanfic

From: Michael Andre-Driussi <mantis at siriusfiction.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 17:26:37 +0000

Hoo, boy.

Look here.  I mean it!

1) TBOTLS is revealed near the end to have been written by Horn.

2) TBOTSS starts off with some revision to that--it wasn't just Horn, but
Horn and his wife Nettle.  There is also talk about the trials of
publishing, from  making the paper on up to the writing of the text in each
book.  TBOTSS is presumably being written by the narrator Horn alone this
time, since Nettle is staying at home.  Now it will be 100% Horn.

3) Deep into OBW (TBOTSS vol. 1) it is revealed that there are some editors
involved.

4) Toward the end of TBOTSS it is revealed that the narrator wasn't so much
Horn writing about Horn's adventure as it was Silk writing about Horn's
adventure in absence of Horn (a switch on the situation in TBOTLS, where it
was "Horn" [Horn/Nettle] writing about Silk's adventure in the absence of
Silk).  Then Silk leaves Blue and Nettle leaves, too.

5) Toward the end of TBOTSS it is revealed that some chapters were not
written by the narrator Horn, and that these chapters were cobbled together
by the editors (all born on Blue; two of them, Hoof and Hide, raised
on/with/through TBOTLS).

Now then, the editors Hoof and Hide.  They are intimately connected to
TBOTLS, but not as primary creators.  They are immersed in the matter; it
is in their mother's milk, if you like.  They are so steeped in the stuff
that I liken them to "fans," even though they did not voluntarily get into
it (and fandom is voluntary, ain't it?).  Because of their unique position,
they are compelled to step up to the bat and take a wack at completing the
manuscript--and they do.

When H & H write about The Whorl, we know fully that they have never been
there themselves, but ah--they =have= been there through the text of
TBOTLS, just as we fans have.  So again, H & H are equal to us readers in
not knowing The Whorl at first hand and not knowing Silk at first hand.

So the writing by H & H, while buttressed by interviews, snatches of
conversation, and editorial consensus, amounts to a patch written by fans,
which is rather like a fan fiction in the broad sense (rather than the
specific sense of "slash" or "Mary Sue").  Now their wives are not likely
to be as steeped as the twins are, but they nonetheless have an influence
on the shaping of TBOTSS, and since they don't have so many memories of the
people involved, their source of inspiration will be TBOTLS.

TBOTSS is, therefore, part secondary creation--again, rather like fanfic in
the broad sense.  It is largely based upon characters and settings depicted
in TBOTLS.  Neither Horn, nor Nettle, nor even Silk is around to help them
in this: nobody involved in the primary creation (TBOTLS) is available.
All they have is their memory and the text of TBOTLS.

=mantis=

Sirius Fiction
Has Moved To
http://www.siriusfiction.com/

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---

From: Spectacled Bear <spectacled.bear at pobox.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 08:10:27 +0000

At 01:26 2001-06-21, Michael Andre-Driussi wrote:
...
>"slash"

It's one of history's great lost opportunities that the inventor
of this phrase didn't use one of the other names for the oblique
character, "stroke".

>http://www.siriusfiction.com/

What are the relations, if any, among www.sirius.com, www.siriusfiction.com,
www.siriusbooks.com (whose web site shows only a CGI directory, inaccessible),
www.sirius-books.com, and the Sirius Book Company who published some of Keith
Roberts' work?

Spectacled Bear.

---

From: Kevin J. Maroney <kmaroney at ungames.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2001 11:33:16 +0000

At 05:26 PM 6/20/01 -0700, Mantis wrote:
>specific sense of "slash" or "Mary Sue").

"Fanfic" is not the same thing as "fiction written by fans"; "fan" is not 
the same thing as "admirer of"; "biography" is not the same as "fiction".

-- 
    Kevin Maroney | Unplugged Games
    kmaroney at ungames.com | (212) 777-1190