{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/1461", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "whorl", "thread": { "id": 1461, "subject": "The Narrator's mistakes", "messages": 4, "voices": 3, "first": "2001-06-21T23:24:34+00:00", "last": "2001-06-22T15:08:51+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Adam Stephanides", "address": "adamsteph at earthlink.net" }, "date": "2001-06-21T23:24:34+00:00", "subject": "(whorl) The Narrator's mistakes", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "While thumbing through RttW, I came across a passage in which Narr notes he\nhas made a mistake, but says he won't correct it, for various reasons,\nconcluding, \"No, there really are such things as honest mistakes; this\naccount is full of them, and I intend to leave it that way.\" (184) This\npassage raises several interesting points.\n\n1) In correcting Narr's \"obvious errors,\" the editors are going against\nNarr's own policy.\n\n2) Narr says that \"I cannot correct all or even most of them [his mistakes]\nwithout tearing the whole account to shreds and starting again.\" If Narr is\nnot just being humble, his original manuscript had a lot of mistakes. We\nmay wonder how many of them the editors caught (there's no reason to think\nthey were in a position to recognize all the mistakes) and how many of them\nthe editors missed and we are also unable to catch.\n\n3) Narr goes on to say \"My new account, moreover, would be bound to be worse\nthan this, since I could not prevent myself from attributing to myself\nknowledge and opinions I did not have at the time the events I recorded\noccurred.\" But of course, everything in his original account dealing with\nHorn's experiences in his own body was written down after a similar or\ngreater delay.\n\nWe've already lost the third-person sections of RttW as a reliable source;\nit appears that Narr's manuscript is not as solid as it seems.\n\nOne other point about this passage: Narr's statement that \"there really are\nsuch things as honest mistakes.\" It's odd that Narr should throw this in,\nbecause nowhere in the preceding paragraph (or anywhere else that I can\nrecall) is it suggested that there aren't. Does this remark reflect Narr's\nsubconscious awareness that his entire account is based upon a \"dishonest\nmistake,\" that he is fully Horn?\n\n--Adam\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Michael Straight", "address": "straight at email.unc.edu" }, "date": "2001-06-22T09:16:36+00:00", "subject": "Re: (whorl) The Narrator's mistakes", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "On Thu, 21 Jun 2001, Adam Stephanides wrote:\n2) Narr says that \"I cannot correct all or even most of them [his mistakes]\nwithout tearing the whole account to shreds and starting again.\" If Narr is\nnot just being humble, his original manuscript had a lot of mistakes. We\nmay wonder how many of them the editors caught (there's no reason to think\nthey were in a position to recognize all the mistakes) and how many of them\nthe editors missed and we are also unable to catch." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "The fact that he felt like he would need to tear up the whole account made\nme think he was referring more to the way things were written, the things\nhe focused on, the things he left out, than specific \"factual\" errors.\n\n\"Mistake\" is a broader word, encompassing, \"I should have started telling\nabout this, skipped that, gone into detail about this other, and done a\nbetter job of explaining these things.\" He's not necessarily saying that\nthere are lots of false statements.\n\n-Rostrum\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Adam Stephanides", "address": "adamsteph at earthlink.net" }, "date": "2001-06-22T15:06:30+00:00", "subject": "Re: (whorl) The Narrator's mistakes", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "on 6/22/01 8:16 AM, Michael Straight at straight at email.unc.edu wrote:\nOn Thu, 21 Jun 2001, Adam Stephanides wrote:" }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 2, "text": "2) Narr says that \"I cannot correct all or even most of them [his mistakes]\nwithout tearing the whole account to shreds and starting again.\" If Narr is\nnot just being humble, his original manuscript had a lot of mistakes. We\nmay wonder how many of them the editors caught (there's no reason to think\nthey were in a position to recognize all the mistakes) and how many of them\nthe editors missed and we are also unable to catch." }, { "kind": "quote", "depth": 1, "text": "The fact that he felt like he would need to tear up the whole account made\nme think he was referring more to the way things were written, the things\nhe focused on, the things he left out, than specific \"factual\" errors.\n\n\"Mistake\" is a broader word, encompassing, \"I should have started telling\nabout this, skipped that, gone into detail about this other, and done a\nbetter job of explaining these things.\" He's not necessarily saying that\nthere are lots of false statements." }, { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Narr begins the paragraph by saying that he has confused Seawrack's ring\nwith Oreb's. He goes on to say \"I should go back and line out my mistake, I\nsuppose, but I hate lining things out--it gives the page such an ugly\nappearance. Besides, to line out is to accept responsibility for the\ncorrectness of all that is let stand. To correct that or any other error\nwould be to invite you to ask me (when you read this, as I hope you soon\nwill) why I failed to correct some other.\" (184) He goes on with the\nsentence I quoted above. It seems to me that he is indeed talking about\nspecific factual errors.\n\n--Adam\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun." } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes", "address": "ddanehy at siebel.com" }, "date": "2001-06-22T15:08:51+00:00", "subject": "RE: (whorl) The Narrator's mistakes", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Subject: Re: (whorl) The Narrator's mistakes\n\nWhat's next?\n\n\"More of the Narrator's Greatest Mistakes\"\n\"Well, That About Wraps It Up for the Narrator\"\n\n--Oolon Cobblatid\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun." } ] } ] }