{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/218",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "whorl",
  "thread": {
    "id": 218,
    "subject": "Vodalus sez Urth flipt?",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "1997-03-17T19:33:06+00:00",
    "last": "1997-03-18T00:01:00+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<whorl-v0004-0248@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "m.driussi",
        "address": "m.driussi at genie.com"
      },
      "date": "1997-03-18T00:01:00+00:00",
      "subject": "(whorl) Vodalus sez Urth flipt?",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Reply:  Item #7558985 from WHORL at LISTS.BEST.COM@INET02#\n\nNutria (aka JBJordan),\n\nI'm curious as to the text wherein Vodalus said that the Urth has\nflipped on its axis--where would that be located?\n\nRe: Cordwainer Smith and Wolfe, well sure, the similarities come down\nmainly to the coincidences of: 1) a fairy-tale style over a science fictional\ncore; 2) some beastmen appropriated from H.G. Wells (who in turn took them\nfrom animal fables via FRANKENSTEIN); 3) a sense of Big History, lifted from\nStapledon, or Toynbee, et al.; 4) a sense of Religion as a positive\nforce; 5) a use of pagan elements to explore the mysteries of\nReligion (for example: the axis mundi part of Smith's QUEST OF THREE\nWORLDS is remarkably similar to what Severian sees on Yesod).\n\nWhich I guess is a round about way of saying that there is more than\none way to make banana nut bread, but certain key elements will\ndistinguish said loaf from zuccini bread or pound cake.\n\n=mantis=\n\nQuestions or problems to whorl-owner at lists.best.com"
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<whorl-v0004-0249@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Jim Jordan",
        "address": "jbjordan at gnt.net"
      },
      "date": "1997-03-17T19:33:06+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (whorl) Vodalus sez Urth flipt?",
      "in_reply_to": "<whorl-v0004-0248@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "At 12:01 AM 3/18/97 GMT, Mantis wrote:\n\nI'm curious as to the text wherein Vodalus said that the Urth has\nflipped on its axis--where would that be located?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "\tAw, man! I don't know! Gimmeabreak!\n\tI've read the Urth novels thrice, but I did not take notes. I dimly recall\nit from the alzabo feast when Severian eats Thecla and brings her back to\nlife inside of himself -- but that might not be the place. Maybe someone\nelse can remember. Or maybe I'm offbase."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Re: Cordwainer Smith and Wolfe, well sure, the similarities come down\nmainly to the coincidences of: 1) a fairy-tale style over a science fictional\ncore; 2) some beastmen appropriated from H.G. Wells (who in turn took them\nfrom animal fables via FRANKENSTEIN); 3) a sense of Big History, lifted from\nStapledon, or Toynbee, et al.; 4) a sense of Religion as a positive\nforce; 5) a use of pagan elements to explore the mysteries of\nReligion (for example: the axis mundi part of Smith's QUEST OF THREE\nWORLDS is remarkably similar to what Severian sees on Yesod)."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "\tThere's a bit more. Fifth Head explores what it means to be human, and\nthat is a large part of Smith's work also. I started with Fifth Head, and\nthat is why I thought there was a good deal of Smith influence. Moving to\nthe Severian books, I saw the same kind of sacramental/symbolic concerns\nthat also run through Smith. Also, both have a real interest in\npsychoanalysis (as in the stories in Island of Dr Death &c.). These, to me,\nwere more striking than the things you mention. At any rate, the\ncoincidences seem to arise from similar religious beliefs, and some similar\ninterests (religion, sacrament, political theory, war, human psychology).\n\tCuriously, there are lots of coincidences between Smith's Norstrilia and\nHerbert's Dune, but both were written at the same time, so they are just\ncoincidences!\n\nNutria"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Which I guess is a round about way of saying that there is more than\none way to make banana nut bread, but certain key elements will\ndistinguish said loaf from zuccini bread or pound cake.\n\n=mantis=\n\nQuestions or problems to whorl-owner at lists.best.com"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Questions or problems to whorl-owner at lists.best.com"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}