{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/258",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "whorl",
  "thread": {
    "id": 258,
    "subject": "Wounded Feet; The Outsider",
    "messages": 1,
    "voices": 1,
    "first": "1997-04-04T22:27:44+00:00",
    "last": "1997-04-04T22:27:44+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<whorl-v0004-0298@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Jim Jordan",
        "address": "jbjordan at gnt.net"
      },
      "date": "1997-04-04T22:27:44+00:00",
      "subject": "(whorl) Re: Wounded Feet; The Outsider",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "At 09:44 AM 4/4/97 -0500, you wrote:\n\nWounded Feet:\n\nI just reread Lewis's _Perelandra_, and interestingly enough the\nprotagonist Ransom is wounded in the foot by the Un-Man (the Devil), and\nthe wound doesn't heal until cleansed by the Perelandran Adam. I think\nthe Fisher King motif is operative here."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "\tSure, but where does the Fisher King motif itself come from? Lewis's book\nis not only an answer to Wells's \"Time Machine,\" but also a thoughtful\nexpansion of Genesis 2-3. The Messiah receives the foot wound while\ncrushing the serpent's head. The Fisher King motif comes more to the fore\nin the sequel, \"That Hideous Strength.\" Of course, behind this is Christ,\nwho sent His disciples forth as fishers of men, and who is the Fisher King.\nWhatever similar stories may have played into the larger FK mythos, the\nbasis in Christendom is the Biblical material. Notice for instance Jacob's\nlimp, received after wrestling with God in Genesis 32. Of course, how all\nthese various streams are mediated into Wolfe is another question."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Scourging the Moneylenders:\n\nI have to believe, potential for Wolfean heresy or no, that the\ndescription of the fortunate man \"enlightened and possessed\" by the\nOutsider is a clear reference to Jesus scourging the moneylenders. \nWolfe has remarked on this story before (in _Castle of the Otter_, I\nthink), where he points out that the only thing we are specifically told\nthat Jesus (by profession a carpenter) made is a whip.\n\n    -vizcacha"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "\tWolfe ain't no heretic. He intends to be fully orthodox in terms of\ngeneral conservative Christianity and specifically Roman Catholicism.\nRemember that one of the biggest themes of \"Long Sun\" is ... enlightenment.\nThat's where it starts, and the large story is that of Silk's gradual\ndeliverance from idolatry. (Wolfe told me that idolatry would be a major\ntheme in \"Long Sun,\" so I don't think we have to debate that; besides, it's\nreally obvious.) The false gods \"possess\" people like the demons in the\nBible. Since demons are fallen angels, possession by good gods in the Whorl\nhas the same basic root. Now, what does poor, ignorant Silk know about all\nthis? He starts out thinking that the Outsider is just a minor deity, but\nsuddenly realized He is much more, and gradually realizes that He is the\nonly real God there is. So, for Silk to give an inadequate expression to\nthe incarnation is not Silk speaking for Wolfe, but Silk using the\nvocabulary he is familiar with (enlightenment and possession) to describe\nsomething he is only in the process of beginning to comprehend. \n\nNutria\n\n\nQuestions or problems to whorl-owner at lists.best.com"
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}