{ "export": { "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/466", "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it. Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.", "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'" }, "archive": "whorl", "thread": { "id": 466, "subject": "Eloquent profanity", "messages": 2, "voices": 2, "first": "1998-05-09T16:35:41+00:00", "last": "1998-05-12T02:31:00+00:00" }, "messages": [ { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "Gordon Brain", "address": "gobrain at netcomuk.co.uk" }, "date": "1998-05-09T16:35:41+00:00", "subject": "(whorl) Eloquent profanity", "in_reply_to": null, "reply_link": null, "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Michael,\n\nAs promised, here are my comments on your draft booklet LS-2, Languages Of\nThe Long Sun Whorl, V0, for what they're worth. Some of the Cant is fairly\nobvious to anyone in Britain as it's still in common use over here (e.g.\nshag, snaffle, twig, sprats) but others are more obscure and quite a few\nstill have me stumped! I'll keep trying though, and let you know if I\nmanage to figure out any others.\n\nAg'in – from the context (III, 103) I'd say this was 'again' (not\n'arguing'). I think this and 'Sojer', (from the same sentence) aren't\nreally Cant, they're just describing Captain Dace's (and others')\npronunciation of these words.\n\n(doesn't make a) bad bit's difference – 'Makes no difference'. From bit as\nin small coin worth 12.5 cents (i.e. one eighth of a dollar - related to\n'piece of eight' = old Spanish dollar ?), survives in phrase 'two bit …'\nmeaning cheap, not worth much. Bad bit = counterfeit small coin, so worth\neven less. \n\nBeat the hoof – meaning 'beat it, 'hoofed it', ran, departed, made a sharp\nexit.\n\nBeggar's root – expensive addictive drug according to text, probably so\ncalled because it's addiction is financially ruinous, reducing users to the\nstatus of beggars in order to finance their habit. \n\nBet the basket – bet the lot, bet your bottom dollar. (Cf. fisc below –\nLatin fiscus = \nrush basket, purse, treasury).\n\nBoilin' – hot, i.e. stolen.\n\nTreat him brick and he treats you stone = like for like, deal fairly with\nhim and he'll deal fairly with you.\n\nCrank - \"(Naut.) liable to capsize; weak, shaky.\" (Concise Oxford\nDictionary).\n\nCull, Cully – a man, especially a foolish one\n\nCully bird – bird which can talk like a man?\n\nDone for = killed (similar to the meaning you gave for 'Do for')\n\nFisc –public treasury (of ancient Rome) (Concise Oxford Dictionary)\n\nFlash cull, flash buck – streetwise, aware individual – someone who's 'on\nthe ball'.\n\nFlipper - hand\n\nFlue – \"smoke duct in chimney, channel for conveying heat, esp hot air\npassage in wall, tube for heating water …\" (COD) seems more appropriate\nsource for a slang term for 'anus' than the sources you quote.\n\nFly – \"(sl.) knowing, wide awake\" (COD), aware.\n\nFroggies = Hoppies, the Civil Guard\n\nGipon (III, 118) – [not in LS-2, v0] – \"a tunic, frequently worn under the\nhauberk\" (SOED)\n\nHoppies – I had originally thought this might be something to do with\n'hoplites', but probably not, given the frog allusion in the text.\n\nHornbuss – fellate?\nHornbussing – fellatio?\n\nLay – a job (esp. criminal job, e.g. a robbery)\n\nQueering a lay (II, 204)– spoiling a job\n\nQueer lay (III, 286) – a job gone wrong\n\nSetting this lay up – arranging this job\n\nThat's your lay, not mine (I, 309)– that's your job not mine\n\nNicker – talk, blab, squeal — (as in horses nickering?)\n\nPlate to me, bait to you – 'Bait' can also mean 'food' (still used this way\nin N.E. England), hence \"I'll get the plate, you get the food on it\", we'll\nboth profit. Of course there is also the meaning of material to lure, which\nis equally valid in the context here – thus a deliberate play on words by\nAuk.\n\nQuill – pure quill = the best\n\nQuits – \"we're quits\" = we're even (NOT we're done).\n\nRollin' him over to hoppy – turning him in to the Guards.\n\nScut – a rabbit's tail\n\nSend sprats to Scylla – sacrifice children to Scylla\n\nShag up = f**k up\n\nShaggy = f**king (general purpose expletive)\n\nSnaffle = take, steal \n\nSprats – kids, children\n\nSolve – \"to loosen, to break\" (SOED), hence break into, burgle, rob ?\n\nStir it - move\n\nTwig - to notice, realise\n\nTwigged – noticed\n\nWhin – furze or gorse, also applied to other prickly or thorny shrubs\n(Shorter Oxford English Dictionary) – hence slang for sword or blade?\n\nFinally, a nice little quote I found:\n\n\"Tis no Disparagement to understand the Canting Terms: It may chance to\nsave your Throat from being cut, or, (at least) your Pocket from being\nPick'd.\"\n\nElisha Coles (1676)\n\nAll the best,\n\nGordon" } ] }, { "message_id": "", "from": { "name": "m.driussi", "address": "m.driussi at genie.geis.com" }, "date": "1998-05-12T02:31:00+00:00", "subject": "(whorl) Eloquent profanity", "in_reply_to": "", "reply_link": "subject", "blocks": [ { "kind": "text", "depth": 0, "text": "Brain,\n\nThanks for the feedback on LS-2!\n\nWe're on the lookout for as much textual confirmation (entries in\nslang dictionaries, like Partridge's) as possible, but we also need\nthe \"sense of\" which I left out in the majority of entries (war\nbetween laziness and ignorance).\n\n(Then again, I can't believe I didn't find \"Crank\" in my =own= OED;\nthat's why many eyes is better than one.)\n\n\"Done for,\" right. I suppose we should say, \"see `Do for'\"? Arrange\nmain entries by infinitive form.\n\nHow to organize all the LAY material?\n\nHornbuss, Hornbussing, Hornboy . . . all very interesting when we\nmuch later (in the fourth book) learn that the narrator's name is . .\n. Horn. Makes ya wonder.\n\n=mantis=" } ] } ] }