{
  "export": {
    "source": "https://urth.darkrealm.vip/thread/whorl/846",
    "note": "Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright in each message remains with the person who wrote it.  Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact.",
    "addresses": "obscured as 'user at host'"
  },
  "archive": "whorl",
  "thread": {
    "id": 846,
    "subject": "Digest whorl.v010.n124",
    "messages": 2,
    "voices": 2,
    "first": "2000-06-20T11:31:04+00:00",
    "last": "2000-06-20T12:02:06+00:00"
  },
  "messages": [
    {
      "message_id": "<whorl-v0010-0367@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Alice Turner",
        "address": "pei047 at attglobal.net"
      },
      "date": "2000-06-20T11:31:04+00:00",
      "subject": "(whorl) Re: Digest whorl.v010.n124",
      "in_reply_to": null,
      "reply_link": null,
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Aha.  I ruled out Crane because I thought you were speaking more\ngenerally--his -initial- meeting with Silk is \"accidental\" (as\naccidental as anything is--the theme of prophecy*, all true, I'm\nbeginning to think, runs even stronger in LS than in NS), but after\nthat he certainly does manipulate things and is behind the political\nevents.  I can post my version of the evidence for this if anybody\nisn't convinced, although I thought that part was common agreement\non the list."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Yes, the initial meeting is accidental. But you have to assume that\nTrivigaunte was looking for a candidate to set up as a puppet in a coup\nd'etat in Viron, and just about as soon as Crane clapped eyes on Silk he\nthought he'd found just the guy to back: personable, easy to manipulate\n(so he thinks), well-liked and with a lot of hard-to-put-your-finger-on\ncharisma. Crane doesn't know that Silk is \"special\" or about the\nOutsider, but since Crane doesn't believe in the gods, that wouldn't\nmatter to him. Wolfe lets you know that he's up to something: he writes\na secret dispatch in very CIA style almost immediately, but of course we\ncan't figure out just what he's up to until several books later. No, I\ndon't think there's common agreement on this, though."
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Can I remain a bright young thing five years from now when\nI'm STILL a grad student?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Sure. Hasn't the truth made you free? What are you studying, anyway?\n\n-alga\n\n\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun."
        }
      ]
    },
    {
      "message_id": "<whorl-v0010-0368@digest.urth.net>",
      "from": {
        "name": "Alex David Groce",
        "address": "alex_groce at gs246.sp.cs.cmu.edu"
      },
      "date": "2000-06-20T12:02:06+00:00",
      "subject": "Re: (whorl) Re: Digest whorl.v010.n124",
      "in_reply_to": "<whorl-v0010-0367@digest.urth.net>",
      "reply_link": "subject",
      "blocks": [
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "alga said:"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Wolfe lets you know that he's up to something: he writes\na secret dispatch in very CIA style almost immediately, but of course we\ncan't figure out just what he's up to until several books later. No, I\ndon't think there's common agreement on this, though."
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Yes.  In fact, the \"Silk for Calde\" graffiti shows up shortly after,\nand Horn lets us in on the (strong likelyhood anyway) that it wasn't\none of the schoolboys who wrote it.  And this is before the populace\nwould (I think) realistically get going on its own from just Silk's\nstreetside conversation with Blood.\n\nOn the prophecy thing--does anyone in the books ever attempt to make\na prophecy (augury) or even have a dream that doesn't foreshadow\nevents to come?  I think that although there's no time-travel going\non here, lots of things seem as locked in as in BOTNS.  Interestingly,\nSilk's first enlightenment is sparse on scenes from the future.\nIs any explanation (other than Silk's \"talent\" and self-fulfilling\nprophecy with respect to the thefts in Lake) given for the wild\nsuccess of augury/random-page-opening?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "quote",
          "depth": 1,
          "text": "Sure. Hasn't the truth made you free? What are you studying, anyway?"
        },
        {
          "kind": "text",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Computer science, formal verification of systems.  For anyone who's \namazingly, amazingly bored see www.cs.cmu.edu/~agroce/research.html.\nAverage time here at CMU is still 6.5 yrs to PhD.  I think it's roughly\nthe same at MIT and all the other top comp. sci. schools.\n\n\n\"And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.\" John 8:32"
        },
        {
          "kind": "sig",
          "depth": 0,
          "text": "Alex David Groce (agroce+ at cs.cmu.edu)\nPh.D. Student, Carnegie Mellon University - Computer Science Department\n8112 Wean Hall (412)-268-3066\nhttp://www.cs.cmu.\nedu/~agroce\n\n*This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun."
        }
      ]
    }
  ]
}