# Impressions, riddles, etc. *The Whorl list — 2 messages, 2 voices, 31 Jul 2000* > Exported from an unofficial mirror of a public mailing list. Copyright > in each message remains with the person who wrote it. > Email addresses are obscured as `user at host`, the form the original > archive published. This file was rebuilt from parsed fields rather than > retained headers, so it is faithful in content but not byte-exact. --- ### Alice Turner *31 Jul 2000, 22:46* > From: "Ian Smith" Hi Ian, and welcome, > No-one seems to have queried yet the reason for the sudeen change in > Horn > between the first two volumes. At the end of OBW we leave Horn still > wallowing to some extent in self-loathing, still questioning whether > he > should be writing his book. At the start of IGJ this has > disapppeared, and > throughout he confines himself to minor self-depreceatory remarks > (very much > in the manner of Silk...). As the time lapse between the end of > writing the > end of OBW and the start of OGJ is purportedly very short (I think > there are > hints that it is only around 2 days?) what as caused this > transformation? > Could it have something to do with the mysterious encounter in the > woods > before Horn meets brother and sister? No, I think it is, as has been discussed quite recently, Horn's transfer to Silk's body, with Silk's powerful gene-spliced leadership DNA having an effect on those he encounters. I'm not quite sure from your post that you have finished IGJ--this will become clearer. > "I found him in he forest, sitting in the dark under the trees. I > could not > see him, it was too dark to see anything. But I knelt beside him, and > lay > my head upon his knee, and he comforted me."(OBW p.378) > > At first I thought this was another neighbor encounter, but in IGJ > Horn says > he hasn't encountered them since they moved him to a new body. It > could > also be a particularly obtuse dream sequence, I suppose. Any ideas? It is Babbie speaking here. It is probably Horn's fever-dream, but maybe not. Babbie is going to turn up again in the third volume (thank goodness, I missed him) and we'll know more. Hi Wombat, > At 12:04 PM 7/29/00 -0400, vizcacha wrote: >> Second, and more importantly (and here we are getting close to the >> true >> secret), there are actually no inhumi. There is only, poignantly, "a >> girl >> trapped in the body of a blood-drinking reptile." The inhumi only >> have >> "spirits" because their victims have spirits, only have intelligence >> because >> their victims have intelligence, and so on. > I don't think this point has been made here: The inhumi seem > specifically > to be telepathic reptiles tht developed their telepathy to enhance > their > predation. It seems likely that the assumption of human > characteristics is > a side-effect of this telepathic ability. I can't tell if they are > capable > of true shape-shifting; their ability to pose as humans is certainly > enhanced by, and may be completely, telepathic projection. Note that > this > does *not* seem to be part of what Krait told Horn on Green, since > Horn > doesn't realize this until he sees the camouflaged hunters in Goan. They are shapeshifters only to a degree and I don't think it's fully "telepathic." Remember three things: They cannot change their density; a careful upclose look, especially at their limbs and hair by someone who knows what to look for, will give them away; they are cold-blooded and cannot fake otherwise. Horn has been given the ability to know them almost at once, but Fava and Jahlee are very careful not to get too close to any human. This is somewhat important to the plot. > It seems that Incanto's travel between worlds is a combination of the > inhumi telepathic projection and the Vanished People's indeterminate > reality. Again, I discount "telepathy," except on an elementary level--"charisma" might be more like it. This is a gift from the Vanished People, I think, and meant, in some mysterious manner, to bring humans and inhumi together, since neither can do it alone. (Though I guess the VP can.) >> Jahlee describes the >> pursuit of Horn at the end of OBW, and how the inhumi all felt they >> should >> kill him, but each hoped that another would do it first. They feel >> this way >> out of gratitude and also, I think, because the people whose blood >> they have >> absorbed would not be quick to kill either. Few are eager to cast the >> first >> stone, sinful or not. Result, Horn escapes. > Well, also, the inhumi are strongly biologically conditioned not to > kill > their prey. In "nature", they will feed on a victim repeatedly over > the > course of years rather than kill. If the inhumi surrounding the Rajan > at > the end of _Blue_ have not fed from killers, they will not have > "learned" > how to kill, themselves. No, you really can't say that. Horn had to clean the sewers, with thousands of people dead from inhumu greed. Unless that was a dream, and I don't think it was. > I'd go a step further: If all the inhumi are treated as human by all > humans, they will *become* human. But I think there's one more twist > to the > secret coming, and I don't know what it is. So far, Wolfe has > overdelivered > on every promise of the narrative; I'd like to think he's capable of > overdelivering on the promise of the secret of the inhumi as well. I don't quite follow. But your second sentence has been brought up over and over on the list, and I still think it is too simplistic. So sue me. Asked Raymond: > I have a quick question. Why did Silk agree to become a part of Pas? Is > there an explanation in the Long Sun books? Just wondering. We have absolutely, positively no proof that he did. This was only a conjecture of the pre Horn/Pas Horn that it MIGHT have happened. Welcome, Muskrat, and don't be scared of Nutria--his fangs are mostly for show: > I have to wonder whether you all are making life more > difficult for him. Does he read these archives? No. -alga *This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun. --- ### Kevin J. Maroney *01 Aug 2000, 11:49 · follows Alice Turner* > At 10:46 PM 7/31/00 -0400, Alga wrote: > They are shapeshifters only to a degree and I don't think it's fully > "telepathic." Remember three things: They cannot change their density; a > careful upclose look, especially at their limbs and hair by someone who > knows what to look for, will give them away; they are cold-blooded and > cannot fake otherwise. Casting back, I seem to remember something in _Blue_ about the inhumi changing shape to travel between the worlds. So they probably do *really* shapeshift mildly. But I think the projective telepathy is real; Incanto's discussion of watching an inhuma die indicates that there's something more than just physical shapeshifting going on. That said, the projective telepathy is far from perfect; that's obvious. They emulate their prey, but not well enough to fool someone who knows what to look for. > No, you really can't say that. Horn had to clean the sewers, with > thousands of people dead from inhumu greed. Unless that was a dream, and > I don't think it was. I don't think it was a dream, either. But I think that the inhumi of the City killed lots of humans not deliberately but out of exhaustion--they reflect the cruelty visted on them by the Vanished People and work (and drain) their humans to death, but do not necessarily set out to murder them. >> I'd go a step further: If all the inhumi are treated as human by all >> humans, they will *become* human. But I think there's one more twist >> to the secret coming, and I don't know what it is. So far, Wolfe has >> overdelivered on every promise of the narrative; I'd like to think he's >> capable of overdelivering on the promise of the secret of the inhumi >> as well. > I don't quite follow. I think that throughout the narrative of _Long Sun_ and _Short Sun_, Wolfe has set up narrative expectations. He then, pretty consistently, has fulfilled those expectations in ways that, I feel, surpassed expectations. Wolfe has spent a tremendous amount of narrative energy building up the "secret of the inhumi". I have a hard time believing the secret is anything we could guess. Hence, I think that the secret encompasses the idea that humans can rid themselves of the threat of the inhumi by acts of loving kindness, but I have faith that it involves something much bigger. > But your second sentence has been brought up over > and over on the list, and I still think it is too simplistic. So sue me. You'll be hearing from my lawyer. ``` Wombat, a.k.a. Kevin Maroney kmaroney at crossover.com Kitchen Staff Supervisor, New York Review of Science Fiction http://www.nyrsf.com *This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun. ``` ---