[SPAM] Re: [SPAM] Re: Urth before Earth

Dan'l Danehy-Oakes · 23 Jul 2006, 05:41 · from 2006-July.txt.gz

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From: danldo at gmail.com (Dan'l Danehy-Oakes)
Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2006 22:41:54 -0700
Subject: (urth) [SPAM] Re: [SPAM] Re: Urth before Earth
In-Reply-To: <200607221655.k6MGtQ5W050768 at mailserver3.hushmail.com>
References: <200607221655.k6MGtQ5W050768 at mailserver3.hushmail.com>
Message-ID: <1f7617370607222241u181d818fw8bf815f9dd5741c5 at mail.gmail.com>

That's a really interesting take. I like it. I'll
have to give it some thought.

On 7/22/06, thalassocrat at nym.hush.com <thalassocrat at nym.hush.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Sat, 22 Jul 2006 16:51:16 +1000 Dan'l Danehy-Oakes
> <danldo at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>Frankly, I think Wolfe kind of wrote himself into a
> >corner here -- by having Urth's history _so_ parallel to
> >Earths, he put himself in a position where there _had_
> >to be something indistinguishable from the Christian
> >Church. But the Incarnation has to be an _utterly_
> >unique event (says Christian theology). So the "man
> >possessed and enlightened by the Outsider" who winds
> >up getting crucified (in Silk's vision) is historically
> >indistinguishable from the Theoanthropos...
>
> "Theoanthropos" is tricky. I think it is only used by Agia, in the
> jungle hut scee.
>
> As far as I know, the usual Chalcedonian term is actually
> "Theanthropos". Is Wolfe making some kind of statement, putting the
> former in bad-girl Agia's mouth?
>
> At the risk of making a lot out of nothing much, perhaps her term
> should be read as "Theo-Anthropos", man-as-god, rather than the
> orthodox "both-man-and-god" (or whatever: I don't pretend to really
> understand the orthodox concept). Kind of appropriate for her, if
> you believe (as I tend to) that she's connected to the black
> magicians.
>
> That aside, my pet theory conforms to some of Dan'l's views; the
> universe of NS had no Jesus. For an orthodox Christian, the
> incarnation must surely be a unique event, changing everything. God
> is outside,in NS; when he incarnates and enters inside, it must
> change everything. Not least, it must end the whole cycle of
> universes, and fix one - ours - as the only reality, now with a
> definite beginning & definite end.
>
> I differ from Dan'l in thinking that Silk's universe is in fact
> ours; the Outsider whispering in Silk's ears on the ballcourt is
> the echo of the incarnation, out of the distant past, but (I like
> to think) happening at the same instant from the Outsider's extra-
> universal point of view. So I think Silk sees the actual, unique
> Jesus in his visions.
>
> When Silk meets Sev, it is not in the universe of NS, but in this
> new one, in which Sev's future will differ radically from the NS
> story.
>
> Anyway, it makes sense to me :)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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-- 
Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, writer, trainer, bon vivant
-----
http://www.livejournal.com/users/sturgeonslawyer
"Shovels are essential to the fantasy genre.
However, they are primarily used by the authors rather than the
characters." -- Stephen R. Donaldson

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