The hut in the jungle

Duncan Truter · 16 Nov 2007, 00:13 · from 2007-November.txt.gz
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From: dtruter at gmail.com (Duncan Truter)
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 16:13:56 -0800
Subject: (urth) The hut in the jungle
Message-ID: <1a0930df0711151613x4550e29ckad3d292dbe4e601d at mail.gmail.com>

Just a heads-up:

In South Africa, a Sangoma is a Witch Doctor. Shaman implies
non-african, to me. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sangoma

I should have mentioned that a while back. This may cast some light on
things. Also: I don't have the book on me (lent it to a friend, who I
won't see for years due to different countries) so I can't re-read
that passage at the moment.

Duncan

On Nov 15, 2007 4:07 PM,  <urth-request at lists.urth.net> wrote:
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>    1. Re:  Urth Digest, Vol 39, Issue 6 (Ashley Crill)
>    2.  Ushas (Ashley Crill)
>    3.  wolfe on writing (scase)
>    4.  The hut in the jungle (Tony Ellis)
>    5.  Perfect memory in real life (Hmpf MacSlow)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
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> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 10:58:17 -0700
> From: Ashley Crill <ash_crill at hotmail.com>
> Subject: Re: (urth) Urth Digest, Vol 39, Issue 6
> To: <urth at lists.urth.net>
> Message-ID: <BLU109-W39001CF1D7246C5E75812E92820 at phx.gbl>
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> > > Doesn't he? If the people who worship The Sleeper aren't on Briah, where
> > > are they?
> >
> > sorry, I meant "on Ushas".
>
> I was always under the impression that Ushas and its New Sun are simply Urth at the beginning of time. The cycle starts all over again with a different name, in a big circle of universes.
>
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> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 10:58:51 -0700
> From: Ashley Crill <ash_crill at hotmail.com>
> Subject: (urth) Ushas
> To: <urth at lists.urth.net>
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>
> > > Doesn't he? If the people who worship The Sleeper aren't on Briah, where
> > > are they?
> >
> > sorry, I meant "on Ushas".
>
> I was always under the impression that Ushas and its New Sun are simply Urth at the beginning of time. The cycle starts all over again with a different name, in a big circle of universes.
>
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> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:50:59 -0600
> From: "scase" <scase at olemiss.edu>
> Subject: (urth) wolfe on writing
> To: urth at urth.net
> Message-ID: <473cbf43.133.3e81.17674 at olemiss.edu>
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>
> I'm wondering about the new book of essays by Wolfe.  I
> can't remember the title, but I thought the
> subtitle/description was something like "Wolfe on Writing".
> Has anyone read this?  Does it contain new material, or is
> it simply a compilation of stuff that has appeared elsewhere
> (for example, Castle of Days)?
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 22:48:30 +0000
> From: "Tony Ellis" <tonyellis69 at btopenworld.com>
> Subject: (urth) The hut in the jungle
> To: urth at lists.urth.net
> Message-ID:
>         <9a33123d0711151448x7ec4f893n5cf1558fa9640be0 at mail.gmail.com>
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>
> I've long been intrigued by the mystery of whether Severian and Agia
> actually travel to the past, or whether the people in the hut are
> simply "chant-caught" Urthians as Agia argues. There seems to be ample
> evidence for either interpretation.
>
> On the one hand, the Gardens seem too big for the building that
> contains them, contain species which the Curator cheerfully describes
> as "extinct", and there's just sky where we should see panes of glass.
> And Robert and Marie talk like genuine 20th century people - where
> would Urthians, even chant-caught Urthians, get such ideas as
> mail-planes and painting in Paris from?
>
> On the other hand, Wolfe allows Agia to expand on her explanation -
> that Father Inire has invested the gardens with a "conjuration" that
> entraps visitors - at some length. The minds of such victims bend to
> conform to their surroundings, the edges of the glass panes are simply
> concealed by tree limbs, and so forth.
>
> Broadly speaking, Agia's explanations are rationalist: it's all
> trickery, it's literally done with mirrors. Whereas if we accept
> Severian's observations at face value, then something miraculous is
> taking place. Are we being left to choose the explanation that most
> appeals to us?
>
> Perhaps, but on the third hand, Agia is the one who seems to be on the
> back foot. Severian trumps every answer she gives with another
> question, until she acknowledges that she doesn't have all the
> answers. That suggests that the miraculous explanation really *is* the
> right one, and that Wolfe is cautioning us against Agia's brand of
> hard-headed scepticism.
>
> These days I tend to favour a middle road: the Gardens *do* bend back
> in time, but Urthian visitors aren't real in that past. They're
> ghosts, "spirits of the future" as Robert says. Robert can temporarily
> see them because he's sick with malaria, Isangoma because he's a
> shaman. The Gardens have a seductive effect on the minds of sensitive
> people, as Agia says, but this is due to their deep roots in Urth's
> past rather than some sort of deliberate ploy on the part of Father
> Inire and the Autarch.
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 23:55:12 +0100
> From: Hmpf MacSlow <hmpf1998 at gmx.net>
> Subject: (urth) Perfect memory in real life
> To: urth at lists.urth.net
> Message-ID: <20071115225516.21F59FE9D at che.dreamhost.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed;
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>
> Here's an article about (among others) a woman who apparently has the
> kind of perfect memory Severian seems to have:
>
> http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/2007-11/memory/foer-text.html
>
> (found via boingboing.net)
>
> Hmpf
>
>
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> End of Urth Digest, Vol 39, Issue 8
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