Severians Later Appearance (Spoilers)

Tom Hopkins · 13 Jan 2010, 00:25 · from 2010-January.txt.gz

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From: topkins at hotmail.co.uk (Tom Hopkins)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2010 00:25:05 +0000
Subject: (urth) Severians Later Appearance (Spoilers)
In-Reply-To: <1bf4dd41001121552r6d24fdf0n65b2c846980200dd at mail.gmail.com>
References: <1bf4dd41001121552r6d24fdf0n65b2c846980200dd at mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <COL121-W2BFFE6D33D9F048093315E66B0 at phx.gbl>

I always
thought that Severian merely said he was not going to write about SilkHorn
rather than promise it? 

Also if we agree this is a previous iteration, surely that would mean that in
our New Sun timeline something must happen to Silk or SilkHorn to prevent him
from contacting Severian?

I think one possible option is that in this iteration the Outsider does not
enlighten Silk, however seeing as he acts as a more "Godly" presence,
I don't think he would have made the mistake of enlightening Silk if it was the
wrong decision. 

I propose it's more likely to do with the Mother figure or an agent of hers
(Sea Wrack), she would have ample opportunity to dispatch of Horn on his
initial journey or even when he returns as SilkHorn. As the motivations
concerning the brides of Albaia are ambiguous and vague I don't see this as too
unlikely an explanation if they feel the New Sun would benefit them. 

However it does raise the question that in doing so, they would be rebelling
against the will of the Outsider himself. If he sent Silk (intially by the
enlightenment) to contact Severian ( If we deem this an alternate Severian who
does not bring the New Sun due to the inconstancies David Stockhoff mentioned)
then either his mission was to prevent the bringing of the New Sun which seems
unlikely, or he is fallible which seems equally unlikely. So I'm not sure if
that is the correct theory after all.

Unless
this was the creation of the First Severian who is created in such a way as to
influence the creation of the Second Severian (who would then suceed in
bringing the New Sun). This then implies that whilst Severian 1 was not special
to the Hierogrammates or any of the other parties in TBNS, (In the fact he was
what caused them to realise his potential  for "saving" Urth,
and as such they then influenced Severian 2 as they saw fit) , but he was in
fact special to the Outsider himself. By this I mean the Severian 1 was
influenced in such a way by the Outsider, that the other parties would see his
potential and therefore create Severian 2 who goes on to fulfil his mission.
Sorry If I have presented this Idea poorly. 

I believe
that?s a viable explanation as long as we accept the Outsider is all knowing.
It also requires the least interference from the Outsider himself (simply Silks
enlightenment, and his possible resurrection in the tunnel later) as he
manipulates the Hireogrammates and the other parties such as the Brides of
Albaia to do the work for him.

Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 16:52:31 -0700
From: davetallman at msn.com
To: urth at lists.urth.net
Subject: Re: (urth) Severians Later Appearance (Spoilers)

David Stockhoff wrote:
Why would Silk/Horn be part of Severian's story of his rise to the throne/ascent to godhood?

Isn't he a significant part of the story? Nobody has mentioned that Silk/Horn is identified by Severian as Malrubius. Indeed, the aquastor Malrubius of the BOTNS is probably strongly influenced by the memories of Silk/Horn as opposed to what the man himself was like. If Severian made no distinction between them, his promise to write nothing about Silk/Horn was a lie, as we would expect from him.

But the Severian seen in BOTSS is probably an earlier iteration of the Severian who wrote BOTNS. Inconsistencies abound:
1) He keeps Triskele longer in BOTSS (into Spring).
2) He knows Merryn better and earlier.

3) His ambitions are better-defined at a young age (to become a guild head, and to write).

There would seem to be many iterations on the way to building the Severian who can bring the New Sun. This one needed the early influence of Silk/Horn, and the next iterations will also (possibly replaced with an aquastor all the way through).

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