Hierogrammates, Briah and Yesod

David Stockhoff · 11 Aug 2010, 12:41 · from 2010-August.txt.gz

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From: dstockhoff at verizon.net (David Stockhoff)
Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2010 08:41:00 -0400
Subject: (urth) Hierogrammates, Briah and Yesod
In-Reply-To: <4C623870.6000705 at io.com>
References: <353082.85313.qm at web84105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<4C623870.6000705 at io.com>
Message-ID: <4C629A5C.2080601 at verizon.net>

I figured the "STL + STL to get FTL " thing was too simple to survive.

I agree about FOB---they aren't really living backward. As Apheta says, 
all FTL time travel is backward---except, I guess, when it's forward.

The rest is disproven by Wolfe's comments.

The higher-vs-sequential controversy leads me away from thinking that 
universes coexist on the same plane. Coexistence only works on separate 
planes.

The biggest problem with Yesod-as-higher (and higher not meaning future) 
is Apheta's remark about the unborn ...

Jeff Wilson wrote:
> On 8/10/2010 11:42 AM, DAVID STOCKHOFF wrote:
>> A universe's limits are definitely temporal. At very least, as you
>> approach any theoretical physical edge, I'd expect a sharp curve in
>> time, not space. I'm not sure how this would manifest itself. But...
>
> In current and time-of-writing astronomical thought, there is no 
> accessible edge of the universe, but that doesn't prevent Severian's 
> untechnical general education from leading him to speak of one 
> literally, or Apheta from answering him figuratively to avoid an 
> unfruitful digression. The end of Ushas, the distant mountaintops 
> beyond the shores of Urth, and the circle of Dis are all figures of 
> speech, metaphorical, but asopted by the more sophisticated beings to 
> communicate with the more primitive but no less necessary planetbound 
> races from which they draw their crews, minions, test subjects, etc.
>
>> When we look deep into the universe, we see the deep past rushing at us
>> at the speed of light. If we were to move into that past at
>> near-lightspeeds, we might experience an FTL rush into the future, like
>> two cars speeding past one another at twice the speed of either one by
>> itself. This might be what Severian sees ahead. I don't think it's the
>> birth of Briah, but the death, because by the time you get to the edge
>> of the universe, the past (birth) is long gone and so is the edge.
>
> This is the reverse of universal expansion as discovered by Hubble, 
> and still essentially in effect through the time of writing until now. 
> Distant galaxies move away in (rough as we know now) proportion to 
> their current distance.
>
> Rushing head-on STL + STL to get FTL doesn't work due to relativity. 
> Wolfe is allowing some exceptions, like the prohibition on 
> accelerating to FTL, but seems to be keeping the time-dilation, 
> Lorentz contraction, and other aspects of special relativity that 
> prevent high speeds form being a simple vector sum:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velocity-addition_formula
>
>> You would get into Briah from Yesod, and into Abaddon from Briah, by
>> moving into the past. This is unimaginable, but then there are people
>> who live backwards in time (even though they speak forwards), perhaps
>> because they are from a universe that runs backwards. (Don't ask.) Or
>> because they are outside time and can choose.
>
> The FOB trio are on a life-long assigment to follow severian's 
> timeline backward, but they move in hops like the rest of the time 
> travelers. They personally experience time in the same 
> moment-to-moment direction, even though they affect some reversed 
> mannerisms, like B backing out through the doorway and saying hello as 
> a means of saying goodbye. I can't figure out exactly why they do 
> that, perhaps it's an ingrained part of their cover personas like 
> wearing the masks all the time, and it may also be a comment on Vonnegut.
>
>> Therefore, the universes may be arranged so that the overall future is
>> beyond Yesod, but all coexist from an atemporal perspective (you can get
>> to X from Y any time---it's never gone, even branches).
>
> This is belied in the story by the disappearance of Master Ash.
>
>> I am beginning to think that the Hieros are indeed our future and that
>> their creators were the future Us, not a past race in a past universe.
>> Thus, all Hieros and all white energy come from this future, moving
>> backwards through time to reach us. Since this means no other universes
>> or iterations are necessary, the whole rerunning of Briah theory (as
>> opposed to merely intervening on Urth again and again) can be dispensed
>> with. It's simpler.
>
> It's also reversing the increase of entropy, violating the most firmly 
> established physical laws we have.
>
>> Does this make sense?
>
> Lovely weather, isn't it?
>
>

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